View Full Version : Squats better than DLs and PCs?
12-12-2009, 10:40 AM
I'm trying to figure out how my best squat is about 305, but my best DL is only about 325, and my best Power Clean is only about 150. Is this ratio totally out of whack? The charts in PP have me at intermediate for everything but lifts coming off the floor, where I seem to be a solid novice. Any suggestions for improving the DL/PC without overdoing it? I don't want to kill myself (i.e. my back) with too much deadlifting.
For reference, I am 40 y.o., 5'10", 180 lbs. I was doing Crossfit until a year ago, when I tried a SS program to get some real strength on, but soon had to stop when an old shoulder injury forced rest, and finally surgery, in June. Shoulder is coming back fine, and doesn't seem to bother squats/DLs, just presses/bench press, which I am taking slowly.
Andy Baker (KSC)
12-12-2009, 10:52 AM
I have similar ratio's to you albeit at higher weights. My best squat is 505 and my best deadlift is 525. For me, it has to do with body structure. I am not set up for deadlifting that well. I have extremely long femurs and relatively short arms. This makes for a very long range of motion from floor to lockout. The best deadlifters have shorter femurs and long gorilla like arms. Subsequently, many good deadlifters are not good benchers.
I have tried various methods to help improve my deadlift and haven't been all that successful as of yet. So far, the best method for me is to improve my squat.
The training cycle I am currently on has an emphasis on powercleans which I have never really emphasized before in the past. I am hoping that the addition of twice weekly powercleans will have some carry over to the DL. I am also rack pulling heavy once per week for sets of 5.
If this system doesn't work then the next step for me is going to put a lot of focus on box squatting. Both for max effort and for speed. One of the Strongman athletes at my gym has gotten his DL up to about 700 lbs and he credits switching from squats to box squats exclusively for this improvement.
12-12-2009, 11:10 AM
KSC and Misciagno,
For myself and many others the introduction of high rep dumbbell rows will do wonders. I took my deads from 365 to 440 in about 3 months using this approach. I just threw them in as assistance exercise one set until failure every week, and then I dug in with a baseball everyday to help with recovery. Id try to break rep PRS and it transfered over nicely. I've found the limiting factor in deadlift strength to be upper back strength. Sure anthropometry is a dilemma, but can be worked around. BTW my squat only went up about 30 lbs but my clean went from 205 to 250 in those 3 months.
12-12-2009, 12:32 PM
Hmm, thanks for the idea, Rbenz. I think I'll experiment with throwing those in on the TM volume day.
12-12-2009, 01:34 PM
I pull 340x5 and squat 330x5, so my numbers are even closer, and can PC around 210. The powerclean will probably improve substantially for you; I've been doing them 3 months and there is a big difference felt between having 200+ on the bar vs 145
As long as your form is in order, anthropometry and specific muscular weaknesses seem to be the main hindrance
12-12-2009, 04:33 PM
Thanks for the suggestions. I read something recently about heavy, one-arm DB rows in some magazine (might have been Men's Journal). The writer had some big numbers and mentioned grip strength coming from DB rows being a factor. (Also, my legs are relatively short compared to my torso, arms seem normal length...I guess). Grip and back strength could also be a factor -- before the shoulder surgery, I could get 20 deadhang pullups and 30 kipping, but I guess that's more endurance than strength. I'll give the DB rows a shot for a couple months and see what happens, as well as doing some more PC work. I'll be back then with results and stay open to suggestions in the meantime.
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