Wolf's Log: From Cub to Direwolf Wolf's Log: From Cub to Direwolf - Page 322

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Thread: Wolf's Log: From Cub to Direwolf

  1. #3211
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    • wichita falls texas june seminar date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Arnold View Post
    I'd love to see you create some D'Agostino-like pandemonium with a beastly final pull to end the day.
    Ya that was pretty awesome. Deadlift has been my least responsive lift, since I got that gnarly back tweak in July goofing around too much while pulling a reasonably heavy weight . It never really fully recovered from that so I haven't been able to push my DL up to even previous PRs, much less surpass them. Hoping these few weeks off, though not ideal all-around, at least helped this issue.

    My goal is still 700, but things will have to go perfectly in training for that to be possible even if I'm having a great deadlift day come April 2nd.

    Quote Originally Posted by JimB View Post
    I second that. Looking forward to seeing you crush through the next 3 months.
    Thanks Jim. Hope I can keep up with the expectations!
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  2. #3212
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    Apr 2010
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    Default The Road Back/Meet Prep Begins

    First full workout back in 3+ weeks today. At Reynolds' suggestion, I changed my usual routine a bit, of how I return from an extended layoff like this one. Though I did more volume than he recommended, I did go up and hit a heavier single today, which I will do twice per week for the next 2-3 weeks, to speed up the process of getting used to handling heavier weights again. Usually I just do ramping fives, then slowly add volume and eventually add back in heavier weights for lower reps.

    Squat SBDs
    135x5, 225x5, 315x5
    365x5, 405x5 @6, 445x2 @6, 475x1 @7.5, 405x5 @6.5 - belt
    Notes: Everything was pretty smooth till the 475 rep. It wasn't a bad rep, just started too slow and then subsequently got too loose coming down. It just felt heavy coming off the rack and I didn't have good confidence with it. It's so funny how quickly that happens. Did 585 for a real solid rep three weeks ago, but 475 felt super heavy unracking and on my back today.

    Two more things. Thing one is that I am, at least for now, trying a thumbs-around grip with elbows less up. I don't like it, it feels way less stable, it seems to affect my ability to keep my knees in place at the bottom, but I really want to - need to - avoid that terrible brachialis pain I was having. Hopefully this will help. I will need more supportive wrist wraps than my basic Rogue cotton/elastic/polyester ones, to squat 600+ with my wrists bent back like that. Anyone have suggestions based on experience?

    Thing two is that I've never squatted 405x5, much less 405x5x2 with a heavier double and single, coming back after a layoff of any significance. So the gainz I've made are apparently pretty real.

    405x5, 445x2, 475x1 squatting on IG

    Press - belt from 185 on
    95x5, 135x5, 165x5, 185x5, 205x2, 225x1 @7, 232.5x1 @8.5, 190x5 @7
    Notes: This was easier and went better than expected. Planned to stop at 225 but it was too fast to be the top single so did one at 232, then back off set slightly heavier than the 185 I planned. Same basic strategy as the squat, with higher starting % possible bc of the less systemic nature of this lift. And same basic thing happened - a relatively small jump and increase felt a lot harder and heavier for the top single.

    Deadlift
    190x5, 275x5, 365x5 - DOH
    405x5 @6 - alt grip, belt
    Notes: My knees actually really hurt during the set-up and initial knee extension off the floor. One of the weird things about this cold I had was the aches. I had body aches but the stuff that sometimes hurts when I train also hurt, even though I was a huge sloth for the better part of three weeks. So instead of now feeling like I'm rested and joints feeling good, my knees and back still ache as if I haven't had any layoff. Knees are by far the worst though. They are bothering me only a little during squats, but stairs and deadlifts are both awful right now. That said, these moved fast and my back felt decent. Knees were just crabby as hell.

    Chins
    BWx4x3
    Last edited by Michael Wolf; 01-02-2017 at 07:11 PM.
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  3. #3213
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    My wrist elbow shoulder situation is slightly different than yours but somewhat similar. When I used thumbless, straight wrist, I would, just like you, be fine for weeks, and then it seemed like it was a certain weight each cycle that caused the left elbow to flare up to the point that any upper body work that day had to be shut down. Luckily, back then, I was on a U/L type split; however, the pain would linger into the next day albeit less painful than the squat day. Then, as volume tapered as I got closer to a meet, the pain would go away.

    When I switched to thumbless, bent-wrist, wrapped, it felt awkward for about two weeks. I didn't like the way that I could feel the weight in my wrist a little but immediately, I realized that I could take a closer grip on the bar which allowed me to have a much tight upper back. This was great because I hurt my shoulder a couple months before I made the switch on a failed squat attempt in training and thumbless was just not an option anymore. At the time, I had known no other feel than thumbless and it was a hard switch but I had no choice. So, this updated grip allowed me to at least lift upper body movements even though lighter.

    Anyway, I'm telling too much story and not enough answer.

    I experimented wrapping with the Titan gold signature wraps, stiff SBD wraps, and with more flexible Gangsta wraps. So far, I am a fan of the Gangsta wraps BUT I don't recommend going flexible right away. There's a learning curve to this wrapped bent wrist thing. I think going with a stiffer wrap initially to learn what positions you can get into is smarter. If you make a mistake, you'll have a lot more support. The downside with stiffer wraps is that you may learn to rely on the stiffer wrap for wrist support. This will lead to painful wrists. So, over time, you may want to migrate over to a flexible wrap. This will provide more options and can be wrapped tighter. Once you are accustomed to the bent wrist position, you will know what you can do in terms of how much bend and elbow down-ness, and you will not do the stuff that brings on any wrist pain. The long SBD stiff wraps are STIFF AF. Just FYI. I love them on max bench.

    Eventually you will be free of all elbow, shoulder, and wrist pain and free to get hodge on all your upper body work without blockades.

    You might even switch back to thumbs over and find that you don't get elbow-itis anymore either. I've seen that in some lifters too like ChadTheMeatBeast.

  4. #3214
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Wolf View Post
    I am, at least for now, trying a thumbs-around grip with elbows less up.
    Heresy!

    But yeah, I've had to do that at times too. It's weird that so many of experience this, yet I haven't seen a good explanation for SOEC™ (Sudden Onset Elbow Cancer).

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Wolf View Post
    I will need more supportive wrist wraps than my basic Rogue cotton/elastic/polyester ones, to squat 600+ with my wrists bent back like that. Anyone have suggestions based on experience?
    Quote Originally Posted by Dwayne_KONG_Wint View Post
    The long SBD stiff wraps are STIFF AF. Just FYI. I love them on max bench.
    I second that. Mine are only medium length, but when you first get them they're like cardboard. They lose some stiffness over time, but they're still way stiffer than the type you've got, or the Schiek ones I used to use. But depending on how much of a bend you want in your wrists, they might be too much. When I do cleans, for instance, there's no way I'd use them.

  5. #3215
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Wolf View Post
    I will need more supportive wrist wraps than my basic Rogue cotton/elastic/polyester ones, to squat 600+ with my wrists bent back like that. Anyone have suggestions based on experience?
    SBD long and stiff. They are far better than the Titan Max RPM ones I had before.

    Here Bryce Lewis shares a neat way of putting them on that I hadn't thought of:

    What My Training is Like & How To Put On Wrist Wraps - YouTube

    Best of luck with your training for the meet, Wolf.

  6. #3216
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    Apr 2010
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwayne_KONG_Wint View Post
    I experimented wrapping with the Titan gold signature wraps, stiff SBD wraps, and with more flexible Gangsta wraps. So far, I am a fan of the Gangsta wraps BUT I don't recommend going flexible right away. There's a learning curve to this wrapped bent wrist thing. I think going with a stiffer wrap initially to learn what positions you can get into is smarter. If you make a mistake, you'll have a lot more support. The downside with stiffer wraps is that you may learn to rely on the stiffer wrap for wrist support. This will lead to painful wrists. So, over time, you may want to migrate over to a flexible wrap. This will provide more options and can be wrapped tighter. Once you are accustomed to the bent wrist position, you will know what you can do in terms of how much bend and elbow down-ness, and you will not do the stuff that brings on any wrist pain. The long SBD stiff wraps are STIFF AF. Just FYI. I love them on max bench.
    Thanks for your advice, Dwayne. I do need some wrist extension ROM here, but several others, in addition to you guys, have recommended the SBD wraps so that seems like a good place to start.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwayne_KONG_Wint View Post
    Eventually you will be free of all elbow, shoulder, and wrist pain and free to get hodge on all your upper body work without blockades.

    You might even switch back to thumbs over and find that you don't get elbow-itis anymore either. I've seen that in some lifters too like ChadTheMeatBeast.
    I hope so. It got to the point this time, for the first time ever, that it was affecting even normal daily activities and hurting almost all the time. Bench was a nightmare. I've used a thumbs-around grip for low bar probably a total of 20-25 times or so (I generally always use it for high bar), at least half of those being in the past few months. So you'd think I'd be more used to it by now, but it could be that using it 4-5 workouts in a row will do more than using it 2-3x/month for 3-4 months. And with better wraps. We shall see. NEED TO GET HUGE AND HODGE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Herbison View Post
    But yeah, I've had to do that at times too. It's weird that so many of experience this, yet I haven't seen a good explanation for SOEC™ (Sudden Onset Elbow Cancer).
    I honestly have no idea. Or why the same grip would be fine for thousands of reps over months and months, then get the SOEC in on one set, and not allow it to leave.

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Knowland View Post
    SBD long and stiff.
    Best TWSS set up ever.
    Last edited by Michael Wolf; 01-03-2017 at 11:58 AM.
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  7. #3217
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    Ordered the 1 meter, stiff SBD sleeves. Looking forward to less painz and more gainz. Hopefully.
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  8. #3218
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    Nov 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dwayne_KONG_Wint View Post
    My wrist elbow shoulder situation is slightly different than yours but somewhat similar. When I used thumbless, straight wrist, I would, just like you, be fine for weeks, and then it seemed like it was a certain weight each cycle that caused the left elbow to flare up to the point that any upper body work that day had to be shut down. Luckily, back then, I was on a U/L type split; however, the pain would linger into the next day albeit less painful than the squat day. Then, as volume tapered as I got closer to a meet, the pain would go away.

    When I switched to thumbless, bent-wrist, wrapped, it felt awkward for about two weeks. I didn't like the way that I could feel the weight in my wrist a little but immediately, I realized that I could take a closer grip on the bar which allowed me to have a much tight upper back. This was great because I hurt my shoulder a couple months before I made the switch on a failed squat attempt in training and thumbless was just not an option anymore. At the time, I had known no other feel than thumbless and it was a hard switch but I had no choice. So, this updated grip allowed me to at least lift upper body movements even though lighter.

    Anyway, I'm telling too much story and not enough answer.

    I experimented wrapping with the Titan gold signature wraps, stiff SBD wraps, and with more flexible Gangsta wraps. So far, I am a fan of the Gangsta wraps BUT I don't recommend going flexible right away. There's a learning curve to this wrapped bent wrist thing. I think going with a stiffer wrap initially to learn what positions you can get into is smarter. If you make a mistake, you'll have a lot more support. The downside with stiffer wraps is that you may learn to rely on the stiffer wrap for wrist support. This will lead to painful wrists. So, over time, you may want to migrate over to a flexible wrap. This will provide more options and can be wrapped tighter. Once you are accustomed to the bent wrist position, you will know what you can do in terms of how much bend and elbow down-ness, and you will not do the stuff that brings on any wrist pain. The long SBD stiff wraps are STIFF AF. Just FYI. I love them on max bench.

    Eventually you will be free of all elbow, shoulder, and wrist pain and free to get hodge on all your upper body work without blockades.

    You might even switch back to thumbs over and find that you don't get elbow-itis anymore either. I've seen that in some lifters too like ChadTheMeatBeast.
    Amazing. I use the gangsters(flexy) for squat and the sexy (sbd) for everything else. Thought I was getting too much side gear. Great minds yah?

  9. #3219
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    Apr 2010
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    Good news/bad news. The good news is Monday's workout didn't make me sore at all. The bad news is that, despite the change in grip, one workout brought some of the elbowitis back in. I high bar squatted today, which in all previous iterations of this, used to feel totally fine, but even that set it off a little today. It wasn't bad, but the fact that it appeared at all, after three weeks completely off low bar squatting and almost completely off of training altogether, is not good. Especially from only a high bar workout. I'm hoping it'll stay minor but realistically I suspect it'll get real bad again. Maybe with the stiff SBDs I can adjust my grip even more and mitigate it somewhat.

    High Bar Squat - SBDs, 3" belt
    135x5, 205x5, 255x5
    295x5 325x5, 345x5x2 @6
    Notes: Lack of soreness from Monday was nice after so much time off. I did have generalized fatigue, however, but these were still easy.

    Bench Press
    135x5, 185x5, 225x5, 255x5, 285x5x2 @6.5
    Notes: Other than feeling a bit of the elbowitis here, not much to say.

    Chins
    4,4,4,6

    Power Clean
    45 x a bunch
    95 x a bunch
    Notes: Haven't done a clean in about 6-7 weeks. Wrists were tight, rack position sucked, so I just did a bunch of super light reps and got used to the movement again. As knees hopefully start feeling better, I'll get to doing these more regularly and with some weight.
    Last edited by Michael Wolf; 01-05-2017 at 01:33 AM.
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  10. #3220
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    starting strength coach development program
    Decent training session today. But I did sustain a minor back tweak due to not bracing hard enough and controlling my descent on one of my squat sets. It feels minor now, but often that'll happen and I'll wake up the next morning with a more serious issue that eats significantly into training. Hopefully that's not the case here, but I guess I'll find out in the morning. As of now, it feels like a much more minor version of something similar to what happened to me in 9/2013 that kept me away from squatting for nearly 3 months. In that workout, though I didn't think it'd be 10+ weeks or whatever till I could load my squat again, I did know I did something more significant pretty quickly. Today it feels much more minor so I'm hoping it'll just be irritated for a day or two, then be able to train normally come Monday. I should know more based on how it feels tomorrow.

    Squat - SBDs, belt, Stiff SBD wrist wraps
    135x5, 225x5, 315x5
    belt - 385x5, 435x5 @6.5, 475x2 @7, 505x1 @7.75, 435x5 @7.5
    Notes: 435 was marginally harder than 405 on Monday but still had lots of gas in the tank and could've done 9-10 reps. 475 was where the tweak occurred, though I don't remember if it was first or second rep. I guarded too much at the top, then dropped in too quickly and got a little loose - loose with 475 is no good. I still completed the set with plenty of strength, but I felt it the rest of the workout and it made me quite tentative on the 505 rep.

    My SBD stiff wrist wraps arrived and I used them today. The good: they're so long and so stiff (TWSS) that they really allow me to bend my wrist back and bear the load more on my wrist, without that load hurting my wrist. The only wrist wraps I've ever worn are the super soft cotton/elastic basic rogue wraps. It's like several orders of magnitude difference. The bad: the wraps themselves dug into my wrist and skin and actually hurt enough to be distracting by the 505 set. But I imagine I'll adapt and get used to this after 3-4 workouts using them.

    Having my elbows down (even though they're not TOO far down) still feels less secure, like the bar is more likely to roll up my back if I lean over, so I think it's making me slightly more upright. That might've been a factor in descending unconfidently and dropping into the hole on the 475 set too. Elbow-itis was present after squatting but much, much less than before. Feels OK now, but like my back, tomorrow will be more telling.

    Squat Sampler on IG

    Press - belt, rogue wraps
    95x5, 135x5, 170x5
    195x5 (b), 215x2 (b+w from here on out), 230x1 @7.75, 240x1 @8.5, 200x5 @7
    Notes: Felt a little heavy but moved OK. Rogue wraps feel like toys compared to the SBDs.

    Press Medley on IG

    Deadlift
    185x5, 275x5, 365x5 - DOH
    415x5 @6 - belt, alt grip
    Notes: Planned to go to 455x5 but could feel the back tweak here so shut it down after 415. It didn't hurt, and it might've been smarter not to pull at all, but I only felt it a little so we'll see if splitting the difference was OK or stupid.

    Chins
    5,5,5,6
    Last edited by Michael Wolf; 01-06-2017 at 11:10 PM.
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