stretch reflex and power cleans

[Gwyn Brookes]

So I've been doing SS for about four months (the original novice program) but didn't learn how to power clean until two months ago (I just did deadlifts every time). I was only introduced to weight lifting six months before SS and I'm 39 (read - low experience and slow learner).

I stumbled across a video (Burgener? I can't remember) where the class was learning to feel that point at the hang where you do the second pull (which I understand is slightly above the middle of the thigh.)

The trainer said that everyone should feel a stretch in their hamstrings and that this tension would produce the necessary kinetic energy to get the bar up.

Well for me to feel a stretch in my hamstrings I would need to lower the bar to shin level with straight legs, and then arch my back from there. I danced professionally until 32, and now even 7 years later I am still very very flexible. I am having a really hard time finding the right movement. My whole jumping technique involved keeping the torso completely upright, the only flexion you get at the hip is because your legs are turned out when you bend your knees. Really different from the "jumping" movement you need to do a power clean.

I have a really hard time starting the pull so high and getting anything but a fizzle. I'm currently at 95x3x5 and feel stuck there. Please don't let me use lame excuses like "short people are better at weight lifting because the ground is closer" any more! :-)

Can you suggest a good accessory exercise?

thanks
Gwynn

[Mark Rippetoe]

I really hate to say this, but our DVD might help you learn the second pulling position from a different perspective. I don't think your extreme flexibility is a problem, and I don't think an assistance exercise is ever the answer to a form/concept problem on a major exercise. Another explanation may be the key to turning on the concept.

[LCN]

I agree about the DVD, it was very helpful for me on power cleans. Just watching a bunch of different people do an exercise in good form over and over really helps you piece it together.

As far as the stuff about hamstring tightness, that seems like overthinking it to me. If you just start from the hang position and practice some jumps with the bar with your arms straight, the thigh position that feels optimal for jumping as explosively as possible is probably the position you are looking for.

[Gwyn Brookes]

Hey thanks for your answer, and I think you're right about the DVD because I learn best by copying someone else's movement.
-Gwynn

[Gwyn Brookes]

So last night I was struggling through my fourth set and completely blew it and couldn't finish. I decided to try something a little different - because I have a basic understanding of the mechanics of the powerclean I decided to forget about jumping altogether and just concentrate on shoving my hips forward -- basically extending at the hip as powerfully as I possibly could.

Well I just about hit myself in the chin with the bar it came up so fast and I did four reps on my fifth set.

My old idea of jumping was indeed getting in the way.

I still did order the DVD though . I'm sure I'll have more places where I get stuck, it's definitely a complex lift.

-gwynn

[Mark Rippetoe]

People interpret cues in different ways. Apparently your concept of jumping is different than mine. But if what you're doing works, cool.

[Heather]

I'm with you on this Gwynn--my body's idea of "jumping" involves an awful lot of knee bend, and the power clean jump feels far more like a hip snap to me. If I think about actually jumping, I tend to smack the bar into my knees on the way up.

[Locutus]

I third this shooting the hips forward cue, for power cleans. I think for full cleans/snatches the jumping cue helps to ensure that the pull is finished.

[Gwyn Brookes]

I started ballet when I was six and danced until 32. That _would_ make my idea of jumping different from Mr. Rippetoe's.

[Aly199]

Anyone know where I can get the DVD?