expansion of nerve recruitment?

[tweakxc03]

ok so yesterday was the first time I really started feeling like i was lifting heavy on DL's... big PR, etc.

by the end of the workout, there were places in my lats I could feel before that I couldn't really engage before.

This morning I can feel the same thing. my right lower lat actually cramped up when i got out of bed... mostly fatigue... but i haven't ever really felt this level of muscle activation before. i assume my left side will catch up with my right once that side evens out in terms of development.

i've read that one of the first improvements to strength is in the efficiency of muscle fiber recruitment as your nervous system adapts. could this be what im' experiencing? my body is starting to fire muscle fibers i've never really even used before in order to adapt to the added stress?

It literally feels like i have a new muscle added on to my body that wasn't there before.

[Jason B]

You asked your body to do something it's never done before (big PR), so it used resources it never has before. It's soreness from a new stimulus, that simple.

[tweakxc03]

well, i've been sore as hell before. i'm not even really that sore. It's just i noticed activation of new areas of muscle.

Just a response to the new weight.

[PVC]

well, i've been sore as hell before. i'm not even really that sore. It's just i noticed activation of new areas of muscle.

There's no such thing as "activation of new areas of muscle".

After a really hard workout you often hear people say "I feel sore in muscles I've never used before!" This is a really fucking stupid way of putting it. You've used all of your muscles before. Many times. The average person doesn't seem to understand that any movement you make requires complex muscle coordination and that you use all of your muscles many times throughout the day unless you're in a full body cast. The bodybuilding way of thinking has everyone believing that muscles function separately, when they NEVER do. Ever.

Here's an example: a couple of weeks ago, my mom took this "boxing" fitness class that was offered for free on our cruise. For part of it, she held the punching pads (no idea what they're called) for someone to punch. She said it required a lot of strength to hold off the person's punches, and she concluded that she didn't have enough bicep strength to do so. I nearly shit a brick.

"Activation of new areas of muscle" my ass. You've just never done heavy deadlifts before.

[mstrofbass]

In addition, it could be that all the previous weights didn't provide enough stress on those particular muscles to make them stress enough to cause soreness. You finally got to a weight that caused those muscles to be stressed.

[tweakxc03]

What i meant by "activation" was that one of the definitions of strength is an increase in the number of muscle fibers one is able to recruit to perform a certain movement under resistance. This is due to increased efficiency of the CNS.

But mstrofbass puts it much better... the heavier weights are clearly forcing me to stress that area of the muscle. However, if different parts of a muscle don't respond differently to different angles of weight, then pullups and deadlifts would work the back in the same way... which is clearly not the case.

so, I wasn't talking about it from the bodybuilding point of view....

there are certain exercizes that will put more stress on a given are of a muscle than others. why else would it be that if you go in and do a shit ton of wide-grip pullups, you are going to be sore "differently" than if you were to go in and to a ton of deadlifts or rows? Before really getting up into heavy weights for deadlifts, I did pullups like crazy... really hard, to failure often several times over. Never once was I sore in the lower areas of the lat where it attaches to the hip. Now, deadlifts are a more complex movement that works the back more effectively, so this is understandable.

However, what would be the point of assistance exercizes like chins/pullups if they didn't work the muscle in a different way?

Sorry, but that's a retardedly narrow response, PVC. I admit that my initial question didn't really make much sense. Really all I was getting at was that I am finally getting into heavy enough weights to start fatiguing the larger muscles of my back, which hadn't happened before.

[PVC]

one of the definitions of strength is an increase in the number of muscle fibers one is able to recruit to perform a certain movement under resistance. This is due to increased efficiency of the CNS.

Actually, that would be an increase in the number of motor units one is able to recruit to perform a certain movement under resistance, which can in large part be due to increased efficiency of the Peripheral Nervous System (PNS).

...if different parts of a muscle don't respond differently to different angles of weight, then pullups and deadlifts would work the back in the same way... which is clearly not the case.

"Attacking your muscles from different angles" is bodybuilding bullshit. This statement you have made here is a piece of shit. Either you're explaining yourself poorly or you have been grossly misinformed about how the human body works, but I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume the former.

[tweakxc03]

Please enlighten me. I am here to learn... not argue about things when I'm wrong or don't know enough about it.

This is something I don't understand... For example, if I were to do pullups to failure vs. deadlifts, and i'm getting a different response from deadlifts vs. pullups or chinups, then what is the cause of this? (i.e., soreness in upper portion of the lats vs. the lower/middle back in the deadlift)

If there is no difference in the way the muscle is worked, then what is the point of assistance excercizes?

i'm confused... not trying to be a dick. This has me lost, esp after reading things like in SS, where Rip does refer to doing the incline bench or dips to stress the upper/lower chest in a different way... chins/rows to aid the deadlift. All of these work the muscles of the back/chest from trajectories different from the primary core lifts.

[The Laughing Man]

and she concluded that she didn't have enough bicep strength to do so. I nearly shit a brick.

That's gold!

It's impossible to talk sense into parents though, as they always know better than you

In addition, it could be that all the previous weights didn't provide enough stress on those particular muscles to make them stress enough to cause soreness. You finally got to a weight that caused those muscles to be stressed.

A muscle doesn't need to be sore to have been stressed.

[mstrofbass]

A muscle doesn't need to be sore to have been stressed.

Never said it did.