Common Complaints

[gjsuicide]

So the question becomes, what is the best way to increase submaximal force production? Isn't it obvious that a man with a 300-pound bench can do more pushups that a man with a 100-pound bench at the same bodyweight? This need not be complicated.

I've seen really skinny guys (I.E. do they even lift... no)do 100+ pushups in an Army PT test, I wonder what their bench was? You're saying if this particular guy increased his bench his PU numbers would also increase? I'm not trying to prove you wrong, it just seems that with the law of diminishing returns at the far end of the endurance spectrum, the effect of strength increasing your endurance has fully diminished. <If that made sense at all.

[Mark Rippetoe]

Light bodyweights are an advantage to all bodyweight exercises. So, if all you need to move around is your bodyweight, being skinny is not a problem. But even this skinny kid can increase his pushup numbers by increasing his bench. The diminishing returns come at very heavy bodyweights. Not your buddy's problem.

[Gerald Boggs]

Don't have any science, but in twenty years in the army, I never saw a guy with a big bench press, that didn't smoke his push-ups during the APFT.

[Senses]

To come back on the whole marathon thing, i know people who run marathons, and are quite successful in doing so, and trust me none of them did squats. So now you might be wondering why? Well while running a marathon there is so much chemistry going on and your body is using up all its resources. Every extra pound you carry is obviously bad, not just because of you're slower, but because more resources, amino acids, oxygen etc go to your muscles, so all muscles that aren't actively involved in running are useless. This is why these people cant bench 50 pounds. Because they literally famish all useless muscles so a squat is out of the question. Also when running a marathon fatigue of muscles is because of lack of these resources.

Also

"Recently many runners inquire about strength training and cross training. One of the questions we'd like to pick up this time is "Should you do squats when training for a marathon?" It is a serious question for many runners since there are various books and sites promoting squats for strength. We want to add to the main theory of promoting squats that doing a lot of squats will only improve your squatting strength. This general strength will help prevent injuries by increasing strength in the knees and hips for more stability. However, squatting will not improve your running nor make you faster. Instead, do lunges to improve posture and to increase leg strength for the forward motion. " www.marathon-training-guides.com

But for non professionals squats, for improving your core strength will help you get better except if you get so big muscles start getting "in the way" but i said enough now, fuck this topic

[Mark Rippetoe]

When were we on the "whole marathon thing"? The marathon is the last thing anybody on this board would be concerned with. It is the most extreme example of a non-strength activity, and I really don't care if these people are strong enough to open the door.

[Mac Ward]

When were we on the "whole marathon thing"? The marathon is the last thing anybody on this board would be concerned with. It is the most extreme example of a non-strength activity, and I really don't care if these people are strong enough to open the door.

Gillian has told me that the world class marathon competitors she has trained had a vertical of less than 12". I imagine a significant door could pose a significant hurdle for some...

[Conway]

I can't think of any logical reason someone would ever need to run for 26 f-ing miles, but I can think of many reasons why someone would need to life a heavy object or could use said strength to avoid an injury.

[AdamJB]

Until I injured both Achilles tendons in 2006, I was into running. Not seriously, I did it for the endorphin high, and to keep fit. Never did any marathons, just 5Ks. I weighed about 170. The Achilles injury put an end to running for a while. After sitting around for a year, unsuccessfully trying to get back to running (and continually re-injuring myself), I decided I needed some other way to get my exercise high. I ended up getting into weight training. Wasted my first year on stupid stuff everyone tries when they start. Bought SSBBT & PP. A couple years later (and 40lbs heavier), I finally started running again. I have to say that I was amazed to see that in spite of my weight increase, running felt easier than it ever had. I attribute this entirely to the leg and core strength I gained through squatting and deadlifting (sorry for using the "C" word there.) I'm not under any illusions; I know that those 40lbs would slow me down if I decided to do a marathon. But for me, a casual runner, an hour (or less) of squatting per week, plus an hour of running per week helps my running more than spending 4-5 hours per week just running. Another benefit: At 170lbs, I had delicate knees. On longer runs, knee pain would always be my limiting factor. These days, my knees are bullet proof, once a gain, thanks to squatting.

[Senses]

When were we on the "whole marathon thing"? The marathon is the last thing anybody on this board would be concerned with. It is the most extreme example of a non-strength activity, and I really don't care if these people are strong enough to open the door.

hahahaha, and page 1 and 2, it wasn't literally about a marathon, endurance running, 3 miles etc... I just extrapolated it.
Also you stated that:
[QUOTE="And if that force is less significant to produce as a % of maximum force-production capacity, you can keep doing it longer because it creates less fatigue. This is especially true when the strength is acquired by an endurance athlete who is still doing endurance work. " [/QUOTE]

So where is the "line" between squatting is worth it because you are an endurance runner and this helps because...... and marathon runners don't squat because it would hurt their performance.
I'm not trying to be wise, just curious.

[Mark Rippetoe]

Are you aware of the fact that most cyclists think squats will hurt their performance too? Maybe marathoners are as wrong as cyclists, if you can wrap your mind around that possibility.