Upper body stalling, lower body progressing

[WestCoastEagle]

Hi guys, in a bit of a dilemma and could use some expert assistance.

Situation:

32yo male who has NBDTFP properly - I will readily admit that I have missed more workouts than I should have, and probably haven't eaten enough over the last 9 months or so. I also don't do Power Cleans. Nevertheless, I've seen reasonable progress.

Bodyweight:

Age: 32
Height: 193cm
Start: 87kg skinny-fat Now: 86kg - better body comp though still fluffy around the belly

Start Now
Squat: 60kg 120kg
Deadlift: 80kg 140kg
Bench Press: 45kg 65kg (Have previously hit 70kg, but this has somehow gone backwards in the last couple of weeks)
Press:30kg 45kg - max was 50kg but again this has gone backwards

I'm still progressing by 2.5kg per workout on the squat, though I often take 2 or sometimes 3 workouts to get all 5 reps. Deadlift is progressing well and last night the 140kg was fairly easy. I'm confident of continuing to increase weight at 5kg per week for the next month or so at least.

When I look at the Strength Standards web-site, I'm well into intermediate for the lower body lifts, but the upper body lifts are disgusting. I understand that these numbers are a guide only. I'm keen to figure out what to to do address this without it coming at the expense of adding weight to the lower body lifts. Do I continue with starting strength even though I've failed consistently on BP and P for the last 3 weeks, or do I go to TM while I'm still progressing well on the lower body lifts?

I have improved my nutrition and have made a conscious effort to get more calories, and sleep has never been a major problem. I suspect technique is an issue - I will post a form check, just not sure what angle is best for checking bench and press.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[Steve Hill]

Two things stick out here:

#1) "I'm still progressing by 2.5kg per workout on the squat, though I often take 2 or sometimes 3 workouts to get all 5 reps."

You have failed to accurately read the programming section. You may wish to re-read it. You're essentially de-rating a Novice linear progression to an intermediate progression by doing this. If you're only going to go up 2.5kg per week, you need to be doing it with a intermediate program, not by just re-trying the same weight until you get it. For reasons that are covered in PPfST.

#2) While you have (correctly) included the increment you are using for squats, you ask about why your press and bench are not progressing, but then fail to include the increment you are using. Facepalm yourself please.

[WestCoastEagle]

Two things stick out here:

#1) "I'm still progressing by 2.5kg per workout on the squat, though I often take 2 or sometimes 3 workouts to get all 5 reps."

You have failed to accurately read the programming section. You may wish to re-read it. You're essentially de-rating a Novice linear progression to an intermediate progression by doing this. If you're only going to go up 2.5kg per week, you need to be doing it with a intermediate program, not by just re-trying the same weight until you get it. For reasons that are covered in PPfST.

#2) While you have (correctly) included the increment you are using for squats, you ask about why your press and bench are not progressing, but then fail to include the increment you are using. Facepalm yourself please.

Thanks for the response Steve.

I dropped to 2.5kg per workout progression on squats when I was no longer able to make progress at 5kg per workout. This happened at about 90kg. I've been reluctant to move to TM while I still think if I push hard enough I can get the 2.5kg increase each workout - the book says to try for 3 times at the same weight before deloading and I haven't had to deload yet.

In terms of the upper body progression, again, I started at 2.5kg, dropped to 1.25kg when progress started to stall, and dropped as low as 1kg (I bought 500g weights to attempt to continue the progression) after continually stalling.

I've read SS BBT, and ordered PPfST - though I'm in Western Australia so I expect it to take a couple of weeks to get here.

Again, I appreciate any help provided - even if that assistance is advice to wait for the book and read it.

[Tom Campitelli]

Realize that the weights you are lifting do not mean you are a novice or intermediate. Those classifications describe how quickly you can recover from the stresses you are capable of inflicting upon yourself. Note that the latest iteration of those standards dropped the use of the descriptors "novice" and "intermediate" for category numbers because of this confusion. At 6'4" and 191 pounds, you are still fairly skinny. I don't know that you need a programming change for your upper body lifts. I suspect either a form issue, or inadequate rest for the upper body lifts. How long are you resting between sets of press and bench press? It might also be time to get your body weight moving upwards again.

[Steve Hill]

To add to what Tom has said, I'd also look at eating (you are 6" taller, and 40# lighter than me, for example), and buying or making some 250g plates. Tom has discussed around here somewhere benching / pressing progressions in which 1 or 2# of progress are made per week. This would also (potentially) hold true for the PC.

I'm partially in agreement with Tom on form - there is potential for form contributing to an error in such a manner that the added workload of doing it wrong places to great a stressor on the body (hence inability to recover in time for the following workout), but then again, plenty of people have gotten very, very strong doing lifts wrong - as long as they get the programming part right.

I am in 100% alignment on Tom on recovery - both between sets, and as it applies to your eating and workout-to-workout recovery.

[WestCoastEagle]

Many thanks for the assistance gentlemen.

I am aware of the difference between novice and intermediate (I should be, I've read Rips article "Why you want to be a novice' about 100 times) - I should have clarified that my concern was that if my upper body lifts made the same relative progress as my lower body lifts, they would be significantly better than they are now. And also that I seemed to be progressing workout to workout lower body (ie: still in novice phase) while upper body had stalled (intermediate stage) on far weaker lifts. I was wondering whether you had seen it before in trainees.

I will up my caloric intake and see how it goes - while I think I've been fairly good at taking 6 - 8 minutes between sets on upper body lifts, I will admit that I get so frustrated at failing sometimes that I probably jump back in too soon. I'll also post a form check after re-reading the chapters on press/bench press.

Thanks again for your time.