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Thread: Foam rolling because...

  1. #1
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    Default Foam rolling because...

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    Many SS professionals have good, data (or lack of data)-based arguments for why foam rolling is a waste of time. I found this interesting explanation for why "knots" occur in muscles and why massaging helps release them. Assumig the explanation below is correct, why does this not apply to foam rolling? And if it does, why is it still valid to say foam rolling is a waste of time? Looking at you here, Reverend Dr JFeigs.

    "Our muscles are made up of bundles of cells. They are long and skinny like the hairs on your head. Wrapped around each muscle cell is an organelle called a sarcoplasmic recticulum.

    One of the things the sarcoplasmic recticulum does is to control calcium flow within the cell. So when there is an electrical signal from the brain for the muscle cell to contract the sarcoplasmic recticulum exudes calcium from its membrane and that calcium mixes with a protein in the cell called myosin. That starts a chain reaction, and then the muscle cell (fiber) contracts.

    Then when there is an electrical signal from the brain for the muscle cell to relax or lengthen the sarcoplasmic recticulum reabsorbs the calcium separating it from the myosin, and the muscle fiber relaxes.

    Now about stress:

    Stress is a big issue (emotional tension, repetitive movements, a blow from an accident, sudden movement, or whatever) that can cause the sarcoplasmic recticulum to rupture or break. And when it breaks, the calcium just leaks out and mixes with the myosin thats present in the area so whatever muscle fibers run through that mixture contract. And that's your knot- an area of contracted muscle fibers within a relaxed muscle.

    Anyway, when you find a knot (trigger point, sore spot or whatever you wanna call it) when you press on it you are pushing that calcium myosin mixture out of the area back into the venous system. Then the muscle fibers can open up and lengthen. The cellular damage is still there but now the fresh blood can get in and repair the damage (broken sarcoplasmic recticulum).

    That's why trigger points tend to linger until they get stretched out or pressed out- the capillary flow is cut off."

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by pshotsb17 View Post
    Many SS professionals have good, data (or lack of data)-based arguments for why foam rolling is a waste of time. I found this interesting explanation for why "knots" occur in muscles and why massaging helps release them. Assumig the explanation below is correct, why does this not apply to foam rolling? And if it does, why is it still valid to say foam rolling is a waste of time? Looking at you here, Reverend Dr JFeigs.

    "Our muscles are made up of bundles of cells. They are long and skinny like the hairs on your head. Wrapped around each muscle cell is an organelle called a sarcoplasmic recticulum.

    One of the things the sarcoplasmic recticulum does is to control calcium flow within the cell. So when there is an electrical signal from the brain for the muscle cell to contract the sarcoplasmic recticulum exudes calcium from its membrane and that calcium mixes with a protein in the cell called myosin. That starts a chain reaction, and then the muscle cell (fiber) contracts.

    Then when there is an electrical signal from the brain for the muscle cell to relax or lengthen the sarcoplasmic recticulum reabsorbs the calcium separating it from the myosin, and the muscle fiber relaxes.

    Now about stress:

    Stress is a big issue (emotional tension, repetitive movements, a blow from an accident, sudden movement, or whatever) that can cause the sarcoplasmic recticulum to rupture or break. And when it breaks, the calcium just leaks out and mixes with the myosin thats present in the area so whatever muscle fibers run through that mixture contract. And that's your knot- an area of contracted muscle fibers within a relaxed muscle.

    Anyway, when you find a knot (trigger point, sore spot or whatever you wanna call it) when you press on it you are pushing that calcium myosin mixture out of the area back into the venous system. Then the muscle fibers can open up and lengthen. The cellular damage is still there but now the fresh blood can get in and repair the damage (broken sarcoplasmic recticulum).

    That's why trigger points tend to linger until they get stretched out or pressed out- the capillary flow is cut off."
    Going out on a limb here, but isn't it because the foam roller won't be able to apply enough pressure for it to work, whereas a massage's pressure depends only on the force that someone's hands are applying on a variable surface area (open hand, fingers, fist, etc.)? The massage also has tactile feedback to properly locate the "knots".

  3. #3
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    Uhh... Where did you find that explanation, because it strikes me as uh, "highly speculatory". There isn't even an agreed upon definition for what a "muscle knot" is or how to find one among the people who believe in such things. There have been multiple studies demonstrating that even very well trained therapists can't even reliably find or agree on where a muscle knot actually is. They don't show up on scans, they don't leave any signs and you can't feel them.

    Now, is this to say a good hard massage doesn't do anything? No, not at all, indeed it can be quite helpful. But the mechanisms behind why are very poorly understood and any explanation coming from a masseuse and not a scientist deeply entrenched in the current research should be treated with suspicion.

    Further reading:

    The Trigger Point Identity Crisis

    Trigger Point Doubts

  4. #4
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    "Pushing calcium myosin mixture back into the venous system"?

    Wtf? Mechanically pushing that mixture. Back. Into. Venous system?

    Wtf?

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by pshotsb17 View Post
    Now about stress:

    Stress is a big issue (emotional tension, repetitive movements, a blow from an accident, sudden movement, or whatever) that can cause the sarcoplasmic recticulum to rupture or break. And when it breaks, the calcium just leaks out and mixes with the myosin thats present in the area so whatever muscle fibers run through that mixture contract. And that's your knot- an area of contracted muscle fibers within a relaxed muscle.

    Anyway, when you find a knot (trigger point, sore spot or whatever you wanna call it) when you press on it you are pushing that calcium myosin mixture out of the area back into the venous system. Then the muscle fibers can open up and lengthen. The cellular damage is still there but now the fresh blood can get in and repair the damage (broken sarcoplasmic recticulum).

    That's why trigger points tend to linger until they get stretched out or pressed out- the capillary flow is cut off."
    Nope.

  6. #6
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    If this theory was correct, a much larger degree of tissue death and necrosis would be present in. . .every population that has ever had a bit of a twinge in a muscle from sleeping on it wrong.

  7. #7
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    WTF indeed.

    Foam rolling does feel nice. But when I stopped doing it for lack of time, my DOMS resolved just as quickly as before. And my flexibility was unchanged.

    It's a zero-calorie treat, and more socially acceptable than masturbation or video games. Go for it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by cwd View Post
    It's a zero-calorie treat, and more socially acceptable than masturbation or video games. Go for it!
    I about spit my drink out when I read this LOL. Funny stuff!!

  9. #9
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    It feels good, makes me feel generally better. Feeling better = better perceived sense of recovery and adaptation = improved confidence when training and improved psyche. Feel better, train better. Train better, feel better. I realize it doesn't actually expedite Recovery, but dismissing the psychological benefits of "feeling better" (if it has that effect) would seem short sighted.

  10. #10
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    starting strength coach development program
    Quote Originally Posted by pshotsb17 View Post
    Assumig the explanation below is correct
    There's your answer

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