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Thread: How Infrequently can one do Met-Con while Lifting and still improve Conditioning?

  1. #1
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    Default How Infrequently can one do Met-Con while Lifting and still improve Conditioning?

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    Currently I am very deconditioned. I would like to improve this, not for any specific sport but just for general aerobic/anaerobic capacity (i.e. so I dont get completely knackered in a spontaneous kick-around in the park, or if I should be so lucky as to 'entertain' a lady friend of an evening)

    My exercise goals are:

    -Steadily increase weight in the big barbell lifts over time (primary goal)
    -Steadily improve conditioning and VO2 capacity with as little training as is needed to do so (secondary goal)

    Currently I'm thinking: lift 3 days a week, making one of those days a lighter day - e.g. no squats - and throw in a short, intense met-con that day - sprint intervals, kettlebell swings, tabata stationary bike, something of that nature. So, forsaking speed of strength gains for some conditioning.

    Is one day of intense sprints / swings per week enough to actually improve conditioning significantly over a few months? Or is it hardly worth doing - I have heard, possibly from erroneous sources, that aerobic adaptations reverse much more quickly than strength gains, so maybe it would need 2+ sprint workouts to make it even worth my while?

    Thanks guys.

  2. #2
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    What is "met-con"?

    Are you completely detrained right now? ie, you aren't lifting yet and are just starting lifting? Or have you been lifting for a little bit and are embarrassed at how gassed you get whenever you move for more than 10 seconds?

    If the first, just lift for a few weeks. If the second, I think it depends on what you want to be conditioned for. Also, how deconditioned are you? Can you jog a mile at a decent clip without walking? Or just jog for a mile without walking? Whatever your goals, I think it'd be good to be able to lift some decent weights and run a mile in, say, 8 minutes - very modest figures! Unless you're old or pathetic, 15 minutes of jogging once or twice per week should get you to an 8 minute mile pretty quick, then you can think about other conditioning.

  3. #3
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    Good questions gzt. I understand met-con to mean metabolic conditioning, by which I meant things like intervals (e.g. tabata) of sprints or kettlebell swings. Answering your q's;

    I'm getting back into barbell lifts after a 18 month back injury (successfully fixed with trigger point therapy). Was intermediate in most lifts, and grappling 3x week, before injury. Been deadlifting and pressing a couple of months, about to start squatting again. Am ~185lbs, ~15% BF, 27 yrs old.

    Havent done any cardio in a year but have been lifting for upper body while my back was out.

    Pretty sure I could do a mile in 8 minutes, but maybe not much quicker. Really I want to be fit for spontaneous games in the park with mates, and frankly, also bedroom activities with the opposite sex. I hate being exhausted after a few mins!!

    Do you think for example, a once-per-week tabata sprint session or say 30-on-30-off kettlebell swings for 10 mins would be effective?

    I appreciate the info.

    As for "repetitive enquiry", mods: I did search before posting, I found a couple of suggestions by Rip that people can add once-weekly met-con to SS if they want, but no indication that this would actually improve fitness - I got the impression he was saying it just to placate them, heh. I'd like to know if it actually is worth it, not just whether you can throw it in without damaging lifting progress.

  4. #4
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    Scheduling becomes tricky. I like a split schedule:

    1: Squats, Power Cleans, Conditioning
    2: Bench, Chins
    3: Rest
    4: Squats, Deads, Conditioning
    5: Press, other arms accessory

    I've been trying to do all of my lifting on two days, which gives me more flexibility on my conditioning schedule:
    1: Conditioning
    2: Rest
    3: Squats, Power Cleans, Bench, Chins, Conditioning
    4: Rest
    5: Rest
    6: Squats, Press, Deads, other accessory, Conditioning

    Of course, the progress on the lifts is slow... but it's been going ok.

    As far as your choice of conditioning.... Mix it up. I would do the prowler if I had one one day a week and mix up the other days (one or two), probably running intervals and some sort of tabata. I'm about to try car pushing. If you mix it up you are less likely to get an overuse injury from say, running three days a week. The prowler is alleged to be the gold standard for recovery.

    When something gets painful (knees from running?), then change it up again.

    My two cents.

    EDIT: of course, if you are trying to do novice progression a la Starting Strength, then you should just stick to that for a while.... 90 days or something like that.
    Last edited by ColoWayno; 05-20-2011 at 11:06 AM.

  5. #5
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    I think 1 day of conditioning a week might not really elicit a legitimate adaptation. But, given your conservative goal of just wanting to be able to kick around the park without dying, it might help. There are good programs that give models for strength training and intense conditioning that you might be able to modify to fit your goals.

    First, if you're going to undertake an intense conditioning program, it will affect your recovery and thus hinder the pace of your progress. There are programs that specifically incorporate strength progression and intense conditioning, but they are "slower" than the novice LP. 5/3/1 "Just North of Vag" does conditioning 3-4 times a week, but only one main lift per training day and has 4 week cycles, CrossFit Football has different strength programs for different levels of advancement, but only trains 1 or 2 strength movements on a 2 on, 1 off, 2 on, 2 off schedule and probably has a heavier conditioning emphasis than 5/3/1.

    Either way, the intense conditioning (especially if the conditioning is really just a disguised attempt at "cutting") hinders strength progress from the ideal, and you have to consider and incorporate that into your training plan.

  6. #6
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    starting strength coach development program
    I think the first step is to test and evaluate your conditioning. Try running a mile in under 8 minutes or just try to keep up a moderate pace for, say, 2 miles. The first should take maybe 20 minutes if you're slow about warming up and the second maybe 25 and then you'll have had an okay conditioning workout, too. And don't make the mistake in either one of going too strong right off the bat. If you succeed, that'll tell you something, if you don't succeed, that'll tell you something.

    Either way, though, there are a lot of roads you can go down, and, given your goals, even the lazy "sit on a bike for half an hour twice per week while watching TV" is probably good enough and may interfere with your weightlifting less than more intense solutions. Okay, and you might want to do a lot of situps. I remember a few times being deconditioned and then having trouble standing up straight from the sore abs the next day after the first practice IYKWIM.

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