Trying to go a couple of weeks without protien supplementation

[Bryan Dobson]

Thanks in advance if you choose to read all this.

The reason I need to is I have been working with my physician on a deries of blood work that has shown a steady Serum Creatinin level last weeks was 1.52 mG /Dl

In inactive peoiple this is a flag for decreasesd kidney function but as you know it goes up in people who train as well as with people with higher than the average lean body mass.
I am cooperating to avoid more invasive and time consuming tests such as scheduled draws and urinary clearance testing.
My doc asked me to cease my high protien diet and protien supplementation. He was doing it through a desk nurse and was listening in when I told her no way. After some discussion I said I will stop taking whey for two weeks but that I was going to try to maintain 200 grams of dietary protien a day. I also told him I wasn't planning on ceasing my scheduled training. All of this is probably for nothing as I think the creatinine is body mass related and activity related and after this little expiriment I will probably get the same results.

My question. Where are some good protien tracking tools(my sources are primarily beef(ground, roast, steaks, liver, short ribs), chicken (breast of all sorts, whole chickens and wings) eggs(usually pastured from farmer ladies in the office)?

I know the beef adds to my blood creatinine but it is one of my primary and most palatable and best stocked protien sources. To make up for the shortfall I n calories and since I am trying to recover and not lose weight I plan to add more carbohydrate sources.

Normally I choose the paleo choices including Against the grain products(pizza crust, bagels, hamburger buns etc) as well as some UDI gluten free bread. I am not shy about any potatoes or sweet potatos. I simply need to eat alot more to keep from going into a deposit.
Basicly I need help learning how to quantify what I eat.

[Jordan Feigenbaum]

Sigh...I basically want to sound off on this physician but I won't, as it's not his fault for being cautious. Anyway, to game the system I'd go ketogenic (low protein and high fat) between now and your next test. Here are just 2 quick reasons why:

-Less cooked meat intake and way less protein overall (since carbohydrate increase would result in a concomitant protein increase, although not higher than previous levels, it would be the opposite way of where you're trying to go)
-decreased water retention= moderately lowered blood pressure ( depending on your individual physiology) which will make your doc happy

I'd be thinking ~100-120g of protein and 200-250g of fat depending on how big you are with <50g of carbs/day. Grassfed beef and bison would be good, especially with the fat.

[Bryan Dobson]

Ok, that's something I wasnt thinking about. I was actually thinking of going the oppossite direction and using the period to carb laod. I am 5'11" and currently 222 .

I really hate for my training to take a hit to satisfy the doc(and I can see my recovery taking a hit), I think he is just following protocol to eliminate the possibility of there being a problem. It's just really inconvenient to change my diet when I have been on steady gains and in the back of my mind I have read enough on the topic to realize it's most likely correlated to a high protien diet and activities.

On the positive side at least I have a doc who is paying attention, I am trying not to fire him as young physicians are hard to come by anymore especially in a small town.

Another thing I may try is a blood draw later in the afternoon(all my blood draws have been morning time and he is not concerned with blood glucose). Between 7 am and noon I put on about 4 pounds of water just by being up eating and drinking fluids. no matter how much i drink during the day I wake up dehydrated due to the dry environment.

[Jordan Feigenbaum]

You're training will be fine in the short term IMO, just load up on caffeine.

The reasoning for your doc doing the test probably center around CYA and a misunderstanding of what creatinine is actual useful for in your population (training, young, non hypertensive). Overall, it's not a big deal and I think keto will be the best way to roll for this short period.

[Bryan Dobson]

OK, Thanks. I really appreciate it. Basicly back to the diet that got me down to 182 but this time only for a couple of weeks. Here comes Mr grumpy.

[Bryan Dobson]

Oh, I am 42, I don't think I gave you that. no medications or chronic health issues.

[Jordan Feigenbaum]

Oh, I am 42, I don't think I gave you that. no medications or chronic health issues.

If you have BCAAs and a carb supplement like dextrose/waxy maize I'd do 5g BCAA + 1tbsp MCT oil/Coconut oil pre workout, 10-15g post workout + 20g waxy maize. You'll really like that methinks.

[Carlos Daniel]

One of the few reasons not to have a high-protein diet is if you have kidney problems. A 1.52 creatinine is somewhat high, certainly meriting some degree of caution. It's very unlikely that your diet caused it, but if you happen to have kidney disease, eating high protein will make it worse.

Back in the day when I used to take a lot of creatine, it didn't change my creatinine levels, and IIRC, the clinical studies I found back then said the same. My own creatinine is 1.1, even though I have a fair amount of muscle mass. 1.52 is a little higher than I'd expect, even with a lot of creatine in your diet and a higher than usual amount of muscle mass.

[Jordan Feigenbaum]

Yea creatine won't change the levels from what I've read and I agree that 1.5 is elevated, but don't you think a high creatinine intake (not creatine), training, and being dehydrated in the AM messes with the test?

[Carlos Daniel]

I don't see how training would affect it. If it were dehydration, it would be what's called pre-renal insufficiency. There are three causes for renal insufficiency: pre, instrinsic and post renal. Pre-renal is when there's insufficient blood flow to the kidney, therefore it doesn't do it's thing as well since the blood it is supposed to filter isn't getting there very well. Dehydration would be such a condition. However, it's not something that happens under normal daily life and usually you'd see an increase in creatinine but a proportionally higher increase in urea. So one thing to see is the BUN.

It's not ethical to play doctor online, but I don't see how this would be something related to a lifting lifestyle.