Can't squat (at the time beeing), need alternatives

[Eirikeb]

Now, before the flamefest goes on, please know that I am at the moment not able to squat correctly, and squatting anywhere over 40kg makes the form go to hell, which leads to pain. Now we all know the difference beetwen good pain and bad pain, and pain that stops me from having sex is bad pain. To fix the squat I probably have to get a coach, and in my current situation thats just not feasible. So I'm playing around with a few ideas. The problem is basicly that my ass goes to the right when squatting, which hurts my groin. And I'm not able to fix it on my own, at least not at the moment.

This is what I was thinking:

Day A:
Deadlift: 2x5
Shoulder press: 3x5
Pull ups: 3xf. When I reach 10 I'm planning on going on with weights, and make them weighted sets of five every now and then. Probably in three weeks.

Day B:
Something to work on the legs. I was thinking splits (eh, you have the bar on your back as in a squat, put one foot forward and than back. Similiar to a splitclean, in a way. Maybe it's called lunges?), one leg squats,
Bench: 3x5
Barbell rows: 3x5

I don't have a platform either (fuck, my bench and powerrack are made of chopped down birch three, nailed, glued and tied together), so i can't clean or snatch.

Right now I'm in favour of one-legged squat, since they might possibly help me make the strength in my legs more even, which is probably on of many reasons for my problem with the squat. Now really, what I'm asking you is alternates for squats, for some period of time. I know the squat can't really be replaced, but I wan't to keep working out, and to do that, i need to work my legs as well, in another exercize than the deadlift. The reason for the 2x5 deadlift is since I'm not squatting, and my DL is still under 150kg the recovery time should be sufficient.
So any input on how to control the damage of this untill I can get a good coach and fix my squat (after christmas)?

[Aslin]

Maybe you could post a video of your squatting problems, this will at least be better than letting your routine go to hell by not including them/

[Carnivroar]

Get a video, stretch, warm up, do hip mobility.

[SmokingSnake]

Worst case scenario I would say do some somo deadlifts

But best way to get your squats strong is squat each time u are at the gym. period

[Mulgere Hircum]

I usually try to avoid advice threads, but I started at about that level, 75lb, and got pain in the right adductor (groin muscle) when I started moving up. I wasted a couple of weeks rehabbing that, but it was worth it. Not entirely dissimilar to your problem.

I don't understand how not squatting is going to fix the problem. It seems like you need to be squatting 40kg, or whatever you can do with correct form, to work on precisely whatever is going wrong. Why not start at what you can do and microload so you can move up as slow as you need to?

[MazdaMatt]

MH, I think that matches Rip's recommendations on asymetrical squats, too. Go to a weight you can do correctly and work your way up.

[Eirikeb]

Thanks for all the replies. It's obious that the best way to get strong at squatting is squatting, but rip's advice was to simply not squat untill I can squat correctly. Trust me on that I am working on it, and it is getting better. (Mainly, the stuff that has improved the form the most is to slightly rotate my back more than what feels like straight, so that it feels like I'm slightly rotated to the left. This is probably due to an injury from Hockey, were I couldn't really move my left hand, and for some reason ended up with everything fucked. (when i think I have hold me head straight up, its tilted slighty to the left ) Also not using my do-wins helped a small bit, but this needs more testing, and really focusing on showing the knees out. The problem is that I am not able to fix this alone (yet), and rip recommended to get a coach to help me, which i will after christmas. I do not have a videocamera available sadly, if not I think the problem would be much easier to fix.

So I am still squatting and everytime now and then moving the weights up, but the squats are not heavy per see. I could easily squat 50% more than I am able without my ass going 10-15cm to the side of center. And trust me, it hurts. Like hell. When I do any acitivaty which involves the legs. Like walking. Which I do for an occupation.

Now I will try some sumo-deadlifts, but I think it will lead to some overtraining concerning the back musculature, or was you thinking subbing deadlifts with sumos, or maybe alternate? Will try some of this. To reframe the question:

Let's say I was on a navy vessel saying that squats were illegal due to safety or something, how would I try to follow the program/maximize strength gains?

[Dastardly]

Deadlifting as your main leg exercise is fine, even if they regular deadlifts. You just need to programme appropriately. You will get very fatigued and will need to run short cycles.

Look up "Pavels Russian bear" for a very intense high volume deadlift & press programme.

Or "Pavel's power to the people" for a low volume deadlift & press programme.

[Bif]

Now I will try some sumo-deadlifts, ...

If you absolutely can't squat, there are things you can do with a barbell on the floor that work the legs pretty well, and as a side benefit, build strength thru the body. I will describe one for you here.

There's an old time lift called the "Jefferson Lift" that has fallen out of favor, but, in my estimation, is still one of the best. Here's a link to a youtube video to demonstrate:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tddh-dvGVCo

I do a variation of these that I find works a little better (sorry, no vid links). You straddle the bar as in the video above, but instead of one-hand-in-front-one-hand-behind, BOTH hands are in front of your body. You, however, CLASP your hands under the middle of the bar and pull it in that fashion. Further, I stand on a 4 inch (10cm) platform to make the pull longer. You can even stand on a higher platform if you want. My variation feels very much like a hip belt squat, but without the hip belt.

This lift works your legs VERY well; better than Sumo DL IME. You get even more by standing on higher platforms (using less weight, of course). Your whole body gets worked in a similar fashion to a deadlift, but the weight is very much centered in the middle of your body, so the lower back does not get as beat as in a regular DL.

Give it a shot. What the hell, you just may discover something.

Good luck!

~ bif ~

[hatmanii]

Thanks for all the replies. It's obious that the best way to get strong at squatting is squatting, but rip's advice was to simply not squat untill I can squat correctly. Trust me on that I am working on it, and it is getting better. (Mainly, the stuff that has improved the form the most is to slightly rotate my back more than what feels like straight, so that it feels like I'm slightly rotated to the left. This is probably due to an injury from Hockey, were I couldn't really move my left hand, and for some reason ended up with everything fucked. (when i think I have hold me head straight up, its tilted slighty to the left ) Also not using my do-wins helped a small bit, but this needs more testing, and really focusing on showing the knees out. The problem is that I am not able to fix this alone (yet), and rip recommended to get a coach to help me, which i will after christmas. I do not have a videocamera available sadly, if not I think the problem would be much easier to fix.

You've already identified the problem (see the bold). Why not work your way up from there?

This is exactly my problem, and it is something that has become progressivley worse over months of squatting heavy. I'm planning on seeing a chiropractor soon for an adjustment to see if this helps. But I tend to rotate my right side forward which causes my butt to shift to the right when I'm in the hole. Rotating my left shoulder forward a tad and pushing my ass to to the right along with knees out has fixed the issue. It feels weird, but it will become habit soon enough.

Good luck!

-Hat