Well there it is. .

[Mark Rippetoe]

I just get the feeling that there is a stigma against straps for deadlift that is all.

A stigma?

[Frankie]

An interesting reaction to such an article.

In the absence of carny-hands, grip strength should almost never be a limiting factor on the deadlift until a lot of training advancement has been made. Rare exceptions aside, there's otherwise no reason why a guy should need straps to pull 500. And once you pull 500, you get to start to form your own opinion about things anyway.

So while I disagree in theory with that quote, in practice it's true 99% of the time. This of course does not address things like a more advanced lifter using straps to spare his hands/calluses for the higher volume pulling that being a more advanced lifter entails, or things like snatch grip deadlifts and such, where straps are really needed to go heavy.

You are talking about singles though - I started using straps for all heavy sets of 5-10 around around 400+ because I was sick of an occasional slippy bar ruining the last rep of my set for the week/fortnight - that's a set you are only gonna get one shot at. That and torn calluses, lat tweaks, damaged floors from dropped bars it just seems the pros of straps outweigh the negatives unless you are talking about competing in singles.

[Frankie]

@andybaker

I just wanted to point out that obviously hook grip and alternating grip offer a mechanical advantage that double overhand grip does not. From my experience alternating grip offers an equal advantage to straps. I’m not so sure about hook grip, as I gave up on using it for deadlift.

I just get the feeling that there is a stigma against straps for deadlift that is all.

The mechanical symmetry that straps provide is also an advantage over the mixed grip.

[Michael Wolf]

You are talking about singles though - I started using straps for all heavy sets of 5-10 around around 400+ because I was sick of an occasional slippy bar ruining the last rep of my set for the week/fortnight - that's a set you are only gonna get one shot at. That and torn calluses, lat tweaks, damaged floors from dropped bars it just seems the pros of straps outweigh the negatives unless you are talking about competing in singles.

I'm not talking about singles in general, and that's pretty clear if you actually read my posts here. I'm talking about normal work-sets for the vast overwhelming majority of Novices, early Intermediates into mid-Intermediates. If you're doing sets of 10, I submit you're either a later intermediate or advanced lifter, for whom I clearly stated this doesn't apply, or else not training the way I think you should anyway, in which case you can disregard my advice for deadlift just as you do for programming.

[Frankie]

I'm not talking about singles in general, and that's pretty clear if you actually read my posts here. I'm talking about normal work-sets for the vast overwhelming majority of Novices, early Intermediates into mid-Intermediates. If you're doing sets of 10, I submit you're either a later intermediate or advanced lifter, for whom I clearly stated this doesn't apply, or else not training the way I think you should anyway, in which case you can disregard my advice for deadlift just as you do for programming.

It sounds like we are in agreeance.

[Michael Wolf]

Is that the new age version of saying "we agree?"

[Treg]

Right. The main thing I'd point out for a beginner is:
DOUBLE OVERHAND GRIP IS NOT A HILL TO DIE ON.

I see this mistake a lot. New lifters don't realize (even though it's referenced in the book) that when your grip isn't super duper secure, the rest of your muscles won't fire as hard, either. They pick up on a vibe that they should double overhand until they can't anymore, and take it VERY literally, and get stuck because they think the weight at which their DOH grip fails must be too light and they have to push through it.

No. Just no. You DOH as long as you can generally, not on a literal "till the bar falls out of your hands" level. Since newbies don't know when grip is becoming a limiting factor, my rule of thumb is that, however many reps you're doing (presumably five but even if not), you should be able to hold the last rep up at the top at lockout for at least 3 seconds. If you can't do that, you need to switch your grip IMMEDIATELY because your reps are already affected by the lack of grip security, and failure is closer than you think.

For the switch to hook or mixed, some corollaries to that:

1. If you're going to use a hook grip when it gets too heavy to double overhand, start building up to it in your warm-up sets 4-5 workouts out to save yourself a lot of pain. It'll still hurt, but tolerably so.
2. If you're going to use a mixed grip, do it for every rep and every set the first 3-4 times, because it will feel real awkward and the extra exposures will help you acclimate early on. After that, just start doing it one set before you truly need it so you don't go into that set changing something.
3. For Pete's sake, DO NOT DIE ON THE HILL OF DOUBLE OVERHAND GRIP. Seriously. Stop this idiocy.

Mike, sorry, wasn’t sure if I should revisit this here or start a new thread. Do you suggest doing any extra grip work to enable people to continue deadlifting without straps? I went through a bunch of old threads on grip strength and saw one exchange from a few years ago in which you basically said that just deadlifting and chinups should take care of it, no need for CoC grippers or anything like that. Is that still your approach? Wondering if I should do some long holds with the bar or dumbbells, or if that would just complicate things by adding more fatigue.

I decided about a year ago to start using straps for my DLs. I had what I thought at the time was a good argument for doing so – in my mid-50s, hands aren’t very big, non-lifting-related injuries to both elbows that seemed to affect grip strength, skinny fingers that made the pain of the hook grip intolerable, blah blah blah. Also, I’m a pussy.

But I’m revisiting all that now and want to take a run at using the alternate grip. When I experimented with it before, I found it easy to do. But I chose to die on Hook Grip Hill instead, then gave up and got straps.

Anyway, I recently had to kind of start over on DL and all my lifts after a health crisis that kept me out of the gym for a while. I’m just now back to deadlifting around 350 for 3s, so it seems like maybe I could drop back to 315 or so and just come back up using alternate grip and see how it goes without losing too much time. I’d love to ditch the straps.

Thanks!