Restarting Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and the program Restarting Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and the program

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Thread: Restarting Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and the program

  1. #1
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    Default Restarting Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and the program

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    I am looking to run starting strength again after many years of inactivity and would like to restart Brazilian Jiu Jitsu around the time I anticipate being able to start training again. I'm catching up on the most recent edition of the book but have read the first edition backwards and forwards and I recall cautions about other activities while running the novice program. My question is should I modify either my Jiu Jitsu training or my weight training in any significant way to ensure good progress in both endeavors? I anticipate training Jiu Jitsu about 3-6, 2 hour sessions with about 1 hour of technical work and then an hour of rolling (sparring).

    Thank you in advance.

  2. #2
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    I would assume you will have a very hard time doing a normal lp with that much grappling. Iíve been able to progress my lifts on a lp and grapple when I was younger, but now I canít imagine being able to. Iíd probably just lp as long as I can and then switch to an intermediate program early if you want to just have fun doing both. Iím sure one of the coaches that grapple on here will have better advice though.

  3. #3
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    I would not recommend starting or resuming both at the same time. Pick one and stick with it for a while. I've had BJJ trainees come in for strength training, and they managed that well through LP, but they're already adapted to that stress. Resuming both at the same time is going to be really tough to get recovered from your workouts unless you're 20 and can eat and sleep more than you need.

    You will also have to roll in a lazy way. You can't drill or roll hard for an hour straight four times a week. Use a lot of pressure and just let things go when you really feel yourself exerting.
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  4. #4
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    Did BJJ for a number of years with a similar program to SS. It's difficult. You either will prioritize BJJ or lifting. You cannot prioritize both.

    If it helps the way I ran my schedule was:

    Mon/Weds/Fri - BJJ class
    Tues/Thurs - Lift
    Sat - Open Mat

    I couldn't eat enough so I plateau'd and ended up focusing entirely on BJJ (and subsequently losing a lot of muscle). I don't know if it's bullshit or not but I was told to basically focus all my effort on power cleans because the guys who clean the most hit the hardest. That advice may be useful for you deciding on your programming priority. The standard novice LP is not anything like you'd see in a BJJ weight room. You will want to find a specific fighting coach to give you a proper LP that will assist your BJJ. Moreover, if you compete like most of us BJJ people do, you will be forced into really, really dramatic cuts that will more often than not have negative effects on your lifting. Keep this in mind.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by j410s View Post
    I don't know if it's bullshit or not but I was told to basically focus all my effort on power cleans because the guys who clean the most hit the hardest.
    And the guys that increase their deadlifts and squats clean more. That's kinda important to understand.

    That advice may be useful for you deciding on your programming priority. The standard novice LP is not anything like you'd see in a BJJ weight room. You will want to find a specific fighting coach to give you a proper LP that will assist your BJJ.
    What does a "BJJ weight room" look like, and how do they train?

    Moreover, if you compete like most of us BJJ people do, you will be forced into really, really dramatic cuts that will more often than not have negative effects on your lifting.
    Sounds like the people running the BJJ weight rooms don't understand my above observation.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    What does a "BJJ weight room" look like, and how do they train?



    Sounds like the people running the BJJ weight rooms don't understand my above observation.

    I'm sure it varies by school. Ours way set up in a, I guess you could call it, more "crossfit oriented" approach. There were some racks available, but a lot of emphasis was placed on the clean and it's components as well as large volume with isolation exercises. Special emphasis was placed on improving cardio as it tends to be most people's constant weakness on the mat. As an example of the approach, it was not uncommon to be running relatively light deadlift sets, 5x10. Too much volume, too light weight. But just illustrating your point they likely have no idea what they are doing.

    I would agree. Knowing just the little I know now about proper lifting I would say I would not attempt to learn big lifts from one.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by j410s View Post
    Moreover, if you compete like most of us BJJ people do, you will be forced into really, really dramatic cuts that will more often than not have negative effects on your lifting.
    Who is forcing you into a dramatic cut? I've been in the community for twelve years, I've met and talked to about a hundred-or-so people who compete, and almost no one cuts any weight except maybe skipping lunch before the weigh in or five pounds over the course of the last week before the competition. If you have to cut to be competitive, you're just not very good unless you're at worlds in the black belt division or you have the wrong priorities.

    The main people who cut weight are white belts who think that's what they're supposed to do and haven't consulted with competitors before.
    Last edited by AndrewLewis; 12-09-2022 at 05:37 PM.
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    Not BJJ, but still weight class grappling... A long time ago, my senior year of high school wrestling, I started the season at 145, like I'd wrestled the year before. One early meet, after cutting that week, I'd had to sweat off water to make weight. I wrestled a guy who'd soundly beat me the year before, and I was whipping him like a rented mule...until I suddenly ran out of steam at the end of the second period, and he rallied enough to beat me by about a point.

    After this, I adopted my new policy on cutting weight, which was "screw cutting weight". My coach was supportive, and I went up to the 152 class, ate like a heavyweight, got a lot stronger, and couldn't break 150, so I never had to worry about making weight. I was a LOT better wrestler after that. A lot happier in general, too...

    Sure, I wish I knew back then what I know now...maybe I could have gotten to 189 or heavyweight by senior year and been a beast... Point being, cutting weight is usually for chumps. In "team" sports, it's more of a matter of "coach needs that slot filled" than it is of maximizing the individual athlete's effectiveness.

    I'm pretty sure the vast majority of people doing BJJ are doing it for individual effectiveness.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndrewLewis View Post

    The main people who cut weight are white belts who think that's what they're supposed to do and haven't consulted with competitors before.
    White belts are the only people who cut weight? I've watched blues and purples going to IBJJF, and ADCC cut 10-15 in a suicide no water low carb cut just to make sure they fight with an advantage. Even high school wrestling teams do this type of extreme cutting. Was your school not competitive? This was very normal for my school. In fact, depending on the competition we even encouraged white belts to cut weight because the white belt divisions in some locals/regionals tend to be filled with underpromoted brazilian teenagers. So if you weren't fighting, ideally, in the weight class below where you train you were probably going to be up against some kid whose cycling tren at 16.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by j410s View Post
    White belts are the only people who cut weight? I've watched blues and purples going to IBJJF, and ADCC cut 10-15 in a suicide no water low carb cut just to make sure they fight with an advantage. ... Was your school not competitive? This was very normal for my school. In fact, depending on the competition we even encouraged white belts to cut weight because the white belt divisions in some locals/regionals tend to be filled with underpromoted brazilian teenagers. So if you weren't fighting, ideally, in the weight class below where you train you were probably going to be up against some kid whose cycling tren at 16.
    The places I've trained had competition teams, but we'd all trained and competed with too many D1 wrestlers and underpromoted belts. We saw guys cut weight before a competition thinking it would give them a sliver of an advantage only to get absolutely destroyed by a guy who was objectively a few years ahead of them. Especially at the white/blue/purple divisions, there's no point in cutting - there's too much skill disparity at the lower levels for a weight class change to make a big difference.

    Quote Originally Posted by j410s View Post
    Even high school wrestling teams do this type of extreme cutting.
    Yeah, this is an example of "the norm is not the right way to do something." In this case, I don't think it's hyperbolic to call this child abuse. An adult in a position of power pressuring a child to lose weight during a time of physical maturation is child abuse - at least in the absence of a medical reason to do so. Most children are not in a mental position to be able to say "fuck that. I quit" especially if the parents are pressuring them to stay in the sport.

    Do you have a reason I may not have thought of for why it's a good idea for a 16 year old to cut weight for wrestling?

    You used some interesting diction previously. You said "...if you compete like most of us BJJ people do, you will be forced into really, really dramatic cuts..."
    In what sense were they forced? Or was the use of the word "forced" just hyperbole?
    Last edited by AndrewLewis; 12-10-2022 at 08:15 AM. Reason: typo
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