Internet Coaching

[Smiler Grogan]

But Stef, someone at my gym told me that lean chicken breasts, rice, creatine and bicep curls would get me fawkin hyoooge!! That, and women shouldn't lift heavy because they'll get big like teh menz.

-S.

You would be both fawkin hyooge AND hawdkaw.

[JLascek]

On another board I'm on, many of us put our experience and/or qualifications, our years training and our best lifts in our signatures.

There's a big difference between
- 2 years, bench 122.5kg, squat 80kg
- 3 months, bench 77.5kg, squat 95kg, deadlift 140kg
etc

I mean, when it comes down to it, if you got big lifts and in proportion (eg not benching less than you squat), you must have been doing something right, so people will listen to you. And if you're not a big lifter but are a (say) physiotherapist, people might also be interested in what you say for other reasons.

Just because someone is strong does not mean they know anything about coaching.

[DeepBlue]

Just because someone is strong does not mean they know anything about coaching.

Yup. Had this discussion many times.

The best coach is usually someone who didn't have a natural aptitude for the sport. They had to work for all their skill/strength/understanding, making many mistakes, refinements and improvements along the way. This develops a deeper understanding of what they are doing than the natural, who "just gets it", and often doesn't see why others don't.

Even better if during that learning they themselves were guided by a skilled coach, and debatably - if they were coached by someone who wasn't a great coach, just good enough, but a great performer: in that case they had to work out a lot of the magic themselves.

A good coach will hand you the knife and fork, not spoon feed you. My view of Rip - he hands you hunting knife and tells you to go out, kill it, skin it, and eat it (Yeah, I'm sure he can cut your food up for you too when you're a weak newbie).

Coaching is a skill. In martial arts all the time I encounter instructors who talk talk talk. OK, I'm an intellectual guy, I like to talk... but I can do that over a beer, in the training hall I want feedback on my movement. When you do the following: attempt the movement, get some physical positioning, verbal guidance of alignment, physical feedback, correction, encouragement for the correct movement, enthusiasm and understanding that you're not necessarily going to get it ALL right now - that's a good coach.

Again, this is something which Coach Rip emphasises in his book. He's not just teaching the lifts, he's teaching how to coach.

In my martial arts school I'm an invited student to our instructor development courses (prob another year before I get to even try for that grade). We cover a tiny bit of coaching theory, but most of the time is spent making sure our own techniques are up to scratch, coaching each other. I can tell you that out of a room of about 30 instructors, there are only a few who are all-round great coaches. And those are the ones who spend the most time teaching the whole spectrum - beginners through advanced.

Are the skills transferable? Hell yes. Example: I trained to become a PADI Diving Instructor. I was complimented on having the best in water teaching skills - where you obviously can't talk all the time. Without martial arts training I'd never have developed the physical observation skills.

So should it matter that I've only been doing barbell exercises for 3 months? Yes. I'm still learning the basic movements myself, making mistakes and refining my technique as I get stronger.

Does that mean I can't assist coaching at a beginner level? No. I've read SS. I can watch youtube and see form errors, and usually guess as to what mental image/physical feedback is being missed. This is because when I started CrossFit, when I wasn't lifting I was watching our coach (prior to CF a olift cert instructor), and the feedback he was giving to other people (if I wasn't spotting... then I was watching my partner, making observations, but holding my tongue).

None of you should be looking to the internet as a coach. Only an assistance tool to your own self coaching, or in addition to a lifting coach. You better believe when I'm back in the Western World, I'll be looking for a coach, so I can learn more self-coaching skills.

[Kyle Schuant]

Just because someone is strong does not mean they know anything about coaching.

Absolutely.

But they at least know how they got strong.

And when we're talking about random strangers giving each-other advice online, that's about all we can hope for. Experienced coaches offering free advice are pretty rare. Bros tellin' it like it is and talking about their penises are much more common. So all we can do is judge by results.

[DeepBlue]

But they at least know how they got strong.

I disagree with this statement. I know some people who can run reasonable half marathon times. They didn't 'train' for it. They just went all out on a decent level of fitness/pain threshold and limped for a week or more. Ask them about it, and they would never mention the week plus of limping. I'd ask because they were people I saw never running. Ask them how they got a 1h 30min run, and they'd pull a big shrug. Some people will train for years to get a 1h 30m half. Most of them will follow a program from a website/magazine or maybe a book. They will not understand how or why the program is structured. The fact that it uses periodisation (or not). They probably still don't log their workouts/resting heart rate/food or sleep intake - and then incorrectly attribute raceday success to their latest plan - when in reality it was the fact that 2 months prior they'd moved house, they'd improved their diet and were getting proper sleep.

There will be yet more who are up there in the results, who go to a running club, and run what the coach tells them to. They probably have insights - we're starting to talk about people who might know what worked for them.

On the internet no one knows you're a dog.

I can say I BP 160kg at a BW of 80kg... but it would be a lie. I can say I BP 70kg at a BW of 80kg, but you didn't see me bounce the bar off my chest, and I neglected to mention I was wearing a bench shirt at the time... (also a complete fabrication for example).


Of course, these are problems you encounter in real life too. As always, you MUST take responsibility for your own training and do your homework.

[nisora33]

You make a lot of great points, Deepblue.

I know plenty of really strong, really big guys where I work, some of whom know exactly how they were able to get big and strong, others of whom don't. Of those who trained right and trained hard, only a very, very small number of them could actually relate this basic information to others effectively. Of those, an even smaller number could teach someone how to squat, dead, press and bench correctly, beyond just picking up the bar and saying "Here, just do it like I do."

The latter two abilities are rare. It helps to have exposure to quality coaching methods. It requires that "coach's eye," which is developed by studying people's movements, doing the movements in question themselves, and understanding how people learn. And you must be an effective communicator.

Juli, one of Rip's platform coaches, really drove the latter point home to me at one of Rip's Florida seminars. It's easy to overcoach the movements, and on the platform, simplicity of direction is key.

Deepblue, I share your background and experience teaching and learning martial arts. For six years, I practiced two and later three disciplines, and I spent the last three of those years teaching the basic concepts and movement patterns to a host of age groups, including children. And that experience was absolutely essential in getting me to the point where I am now, where I can look at someone and intuit where the movements are lacking. But additionally, it took seeing how proper coaching, particularly the platform variety, is done in order that I could make the best use of my other coaching powers.

So let me take this opportunity once more to say that if you haven't been to a Rip seminar, you should because your training will not be complete without it.

-Stacey

[Gary Gibson]

Absolutely.

But they at least know how they got strong.

And when we're talking about random strangers giving each-other advice online, that's about all we can hope for. Experienced coaches offering free advice are pretty rare. Bros tellin' it like it is and talking about their penises are much more common. So all we can do is judge by results.

Jeesuz Christ. It was meant to be a joke.

And not all us negroes go by "bro."

Edit: Reminds me of a joke...

A young man is walking through a small village one day and decides to stop by a bar and have a beer. He walks into a bar, and sees a grizzled old man, crying into his beer. Curious, the young man sits down and says, "Hey old timer, why the long face?"
The old man looks at him and points out the window, "See that dock out there? I built that dock with my own two hands, plank by plank, nail by nail, but do they call me McGregor the dockbuilder? No, no."
The old man continued, "And see that ship out there? I’ve been fishing these waters for my village for 35 years! But do they call me McGregor the fisherman? No, no."
The old man continued, "And see all the crops in the farms out there? I planted and have been farming those crops for my village for nearly 45 years! But do they call me McGregor the farmer? No, no."
The old man starts to cry again, "But you fuck one goat..."

[misspelledgeoff]

lulz! i love that joke, bro.

[nisora33]

Bumping in light of the ongoing newbie flood.

-s.

[IWillLiveFreeOrDie]

I'm not an internet trainer, but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night!

Good post Stacey. If anything, I think you have pointed out that people should be wary of consuming too much advice on a forum. These moves should become second nature, and if you fret over every little form detail that will never hand. The mind can definitely get in the way of the body.