A Debate on Solutions with John Horgan | Starting Strength Radio #88

[stef]

Mark Rippetoe and science journalist John Horgan have a discussion on possible paths forward for individuals and businesses and debate the question of how much government intervention in an individual's health is too much.

[Panda]

Wow !
The composure of Mr Rippetoe was outstanding.
40 years of barbell training has clearly built some internal fortitude not just outward strength.
You are a better man than me Sir.
Please capture more young minds than the other guy otherwise we really are all fucked.

[Anon]

I like your attitude about the number of deaths required to justify a lockdown. It reminds me of the counter to the silly “argument” “How many children have to die before you give up your assault weapon?”

“All of them.”

It sound callous to the cattle, but it’s just emphasizing the idea that we have certain rights and no Chuck Schumer or Bill Gates or Anthony Fauci should be allowed to trample on.

I have a few links you might be interested in. You may well have seen many of them, but maybe there are a couple you haven’t and they may be useful for other people.

As for lockdowns, Knut Wittkowski’s debate with Marty Makary from Johns Hopkins.

Were the Lockdowns a Mistake? A Soho Forum Debate – Reason.com
Did the Lockdowns Save Thousands of Lives? A Soho Forum Debate - YouTube

Interestingly, when asked by someone earlier on if lockdowns ever made sense, I’ve heard Knut point out that only very early on and that by the time you knew there was a new respiratory virus spreading, it was likely too late for lockdowns and that the policy should be population immunity with protection of vulnerable groups. Of course when Trump tried to limit travel from China early on he was mocked by the likes of Andrew Cuomo.

As far as any excess deaths are concerned, a couple of articles have been going around for months pointing the contribution of lockdowns and fear mongering.

Doctors: Don't Avoid ER Care For Heart Attack, Stroke

‘Since the coronavirus pandemic hit, the number of patients visiting emergency rooms nationwide has dropped by 40 to 50 percent, says William Jaquis, M.D., an emergency medicine physician in Aventura, Fla., and president of the American College of Emergency Physicians.
"We are afraid that patients could potentially die at home,” Jaquis warns.
Older adults are especially at risk because they are more likely to have cardiovascular disease, diabetes and other chronic medical conditions that make putting off emergency care especially risky, doctors say.
Dale Criner, M.D., an emergency room physician in Memphis, Tenn., says paramedics there are reporting an increase in the number of cardiac calls they've responded to where the patient died before they arrived.
"When they talk to the family, it turns out the patient had chest pain or shortness of breath for a few days but was too afraid to come to the hospital,” he says. “It's heartbreaking."’

Statistics Show the Deadly Cost of Lockdown Policies | City Journal

‘Inpatient admissions nationwide in VA hospitals, the nation’s largest hospital system, were down 42 percent for six emergency conditions—stroke, myocardial infarction (MI), heart failure, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, appendicitis, and pneumonia—during six weeks of the Covid-19 pandemic (March 11 to April 21) compared with the six weeks immediately prior (January 29 to March 10). The drop was significant for all six conditions and ranged from a decrease of 40 percent for MI to 57 percent for appendicitis. No such decrease in admissions was found for the same six-week period in 2019. These emergency conditions did not become any less lethal as a result of the pandemic; rather, people simply died from acute illnesses that would have been treated in normal times.

Deaths from chronic, non-emergent conditions also increased as patients put off maintenance visits and their medical conditions deteriorated. In the second study of excess deaths, the five states with the most Covid-19 deaths from March through April (Massachusetts, Michigan, New Jersey, New York, and Pennsylvania), experienced large proportional increases in deaths from non-respiratory underlying causes, including diabetes (96 percent), heart diseases (89 percent), Alzheimer’s disease (64 percent), and cerebrovascular diseases (35 percent). New York City—the nation’s Covid-19 epicenter during that period—experienced the largest increases in non-respiratory deaths, notably from heart disease (398 percent) and diabetes (356 percent).’

Good job with your debate. It reminded of the Knut Wittkowski debate with Marty Makary. One side had science and reason, the other only feelings and a smug attitude. At least your friend John admitted early on that you knew more about this than he did.

[skinnylittleturd]

I watched 10 minutes of this podcast. the only one ever I haven't watched fully. As soon as the cuckold said he thought more lockdowns were in order I checked out. If i wanted to hear panty-waste authoritarian losers I would watch the news. No disrespect to Mark and I will just comfort myself with the thought that he hip drived that loser with facts and reason. My suggestion would be to have people that agree with you on the show. we hear PLENTY from the wrong side already. Especially this twit that admitted he hadnt read anything and you knew more than him. wtf was the point?

Rippitoe/Jones 2024