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Thread: Doug Brignole and his opposing views from SS

  1. #1
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    Default Doug Brignole and his opposing views from SS

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    Doug Brignole Mr. America and Universe “ Why You Should Not Use "Compound Exercises" If Your Goal Is Maximum Muscle Development, with the least amount of wasted time & energy”

    First off I find Doug s information interesting and just bring it to Mark and the SS team attention because I value their opinions.

    It seems Doug has opposing views on a lot of things involving training and especially on the exercises and their effectiveness and safety. For sample he doesn’t seem to like the Over Head Press or Deadlift. For example What You Should Know About Overhead Press - YouTube

    It would be very interesting to hear Mark or a appointed SS representative debate Doug professionally or at least debunk his opinions if possible.

    Thanks

  2. #2
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    What good would it do to anyone for Rip or an SSC to debate Doug? I can tell from his video he's just going to shotgun jargon at the audience until they're too confused to actually understand the point.

    In regards to the video, of course the overhead press doesn't seem like a good idea when you don't know how to press correctly. The entire video is a strawman argument of a press technique we don't advocate.
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    It's a good thing the "bad" pressing this guy is talking about isn't at all included in the blue book. Someone should also explain to him the scapula can actually move around to prevent impingement. So much bad advice from bodybuilding guys, I don't know why it is. I was looking back through my copy of Arnold's book recently and I still can't wrap my head around his actual training methodology he recommends in it. Resting only 1 minute after taking a set to failure, then doing it again at an increased weight? What the hell?

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    Since Brignole is a bodybuilder and interested in aesthetics or strength, who cares what he thinks. It's about Starting Strength, not Maximum Muscle Development. Comparing apples to dragon fruit.

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    His opinions have been debunked here: Starting Strength: Basic Barbell Training, 3rd edition (Current Revision, Paperback) – The Aasgaard Company

    The fact that he doesn't know it should not be surprising.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    His opinions have been debunked here: Starting Strength: Basic Barbell Training, 3rd edition (Current Revision, Paperback) – The Aasgaard Company

    The fact that he doesn't know it should not be surprising.
    But, Mr. America, it is surprising that the barbell goes up at all, since the deltoid’s origin moves away from the insertion as the scapula retracts. The deltoids contract less than they do in a lateral dumbell raise. Which is why we can lateral raise more weight than overhead press. Wait…

    This does raise a question for the uninformed about the mechanics of contraction. Must a muscle be fully contracted (shortened?) under a limit load?

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    I initially thought the same thing but then it made me think isn’t a bigger muscle a stronger muscle? So I wondered if Doug hypothetically gained the same amount of muscle in every muscle used in the major lifts as A Doug that made the gains from doing major lifts wouldn’t he be equal in strength in the end? IDK just asking.

    Thanks for reply

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    Quote Originally Posted by cdsole View Post
    I initially thought the same thing but then it made me think isn’t a bigger muscle a stronger muscle? So I wondered if Doug hypothetically gained the same amount of muscle in every muscle used in the major lifts as A Doug that made the gains from doing major lifts wouldn’t he be equal in strength in the end? IDK just asking.
    Strength involves a hell of a lot more than just muscle, so no, getting a muscle here and there bigger doesn't make the whole skeletal+connective tissues+neuromuscular control/coordination/activation/balance/skill+mental preparation+ability to isometrically hold everything together from the trunk & valsalva to the stabiliizers while moving from point A to B and back again system stronger. Not even if the bigger muscles are stronger. Sure, you get a little, but it's an expensive, inefficient, ass backwards way to do it.

    This would be like learning the spelling and one definition each of a bunch of big, long, important-looking words, but not ever using them in sentences or paragraphs or essays during that time, but expecting your communication from going from hammered shit to anything better when you finally vomit them out on the page.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark E. Hurling View Post
    Since Brignole is a bodybuilder and interested in aesthetics or strength, who cares what he thinks. It's about Starting Strength, not Maximum Muscle Development. Comparing apples to dragon fruit.
    I think terrible bodybuilder advice often gets let off the hook too much with that explanation, even though it is accurate. I don't think this shit is even good BODYBUILDING advice, much less good strength advice. I think the truth is optimal bodybuilding probably should include heavy strength work, and in fact someone wanting to do bodybuilding should begin by just training strength for a while and getting the numbers up. Get the muscles first before you worry about pump or sarcoplasmic hypertrophy or "muscle separations".The original bodybuilders were just strength guys trying to figure out how best to show off their muscles anyway. If you want big muscular shoulders and intend to get them from just doing lateral raises, I hope you have a good connection to a shady pharmaceutical supplier.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CommanderFun View Post
    I think terrible bodybuilder advice often gets let off the hook too much with that explanation, even though it is accurate. I don't think this shit is even good BODYBUILDING advice, much less good strength advice. I think the truth is optimal bodybuilding probably should include heavy strength work, and in fact someone wanting to do bodybuilding should begin by just training strength for a while and getting the numbers up. Get the muscles first before you worry about pump or sarcoplasmic hypertrophy or "muscle separations".The original bodybuilders were just strength guys trying to figure out how best to show off their muscles anyway. If you want big muscular shoulders and intend to get them from just doing lateral raises, I hope you have a good connection to a shady pharmaceutical supplier.
    Isn't it explained in the grey book that if you want to do bodybuilding stuff, you're best off doing your SS novice LP first? I thought it was, but admittedly it has been a while since I ready it through, so I could be wrong.

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