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Thread: Rippetoe is right: Sneakers suck!

  1. #21
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    OMG that link to that freaking cheese...

    I can see cooking frying bugs, they might be pretty damn tasty. And maggots as diseased tissue removers, I'm all for it. Especially if in a plane wreck in the Andes and my cohorts are looking hungry, eat away buddies make me whole again.

    But eating cheese full of maggots is beyond me. Sorry I was just incredulous.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    So except for the roundabouts, the things you like about the UK are the parts where you get other people's money from the government. Fix this childish attitude and the next time I'm there I'll buy the beer.
    Well, not exactly. It's better than the government getting other people's money from the government.

    With regards to:

    Roundabouts: Yes, they're fantastic. They should be everywhere.

    No Commercials: No, not to do with the government. We pay ?140 a year (per household) for a TV License which goes to the networks. Worth every penny not to have a show stopped every 4 minutes for commercials.

    Primary/Secondary Education: Not to do with taking peoples money through the government. What I mean is that they tend to push academics a little more in children, such that 15-16 year olds here are at about the same level academically as 17-18 year olds in the US. I found this out first hand the hard way when I came here straight from high school to go to university.

    Subsidised Higher Education: It works a lot like inter-state HE in the US. If you're resident in a state you get reduced fees. Same in the UK except it's across the entire country and there's an upper cap no matter what school it is. Statistically, people with degrees tend to earn more and it can't be a bad thing that more people are educated. Let's put it this way, I personally would not have been able to study medicine to become a doctor in the US, due to the cost. And those that statistically make more money, will statistically pay back more into taxes. And having a more people in higher education can only be a good thing for a society.

    Healthcare: This, obviously, isn't as straightforward. No I know plenty of people have pretty strong views on the idea of "Socialized Medicine". No, it's not perfect. Neither, frankly, is the US model of healthcare. I've lived in both countries, I've experienced a variety of scenarios regarding healthcare coverage such as Veteran's family health insurance, employer's health insurance, NO health insurance, NHS coverage (the UK healthcare) and private healthcare IN the UK. There are a lot of myths and untruths with regards to both models; i.e. that in the US, ER's won't accept you after a car crash unless you have insurance or that in the UK they're rationing out band-aids in communist-style hospitals run by politicians with an iron fist. Hopefully people will realise it's nothing like that. People pay their taxes, and it comes back to them if they need it. "Pre-existing condition" is not really a term that strikes fear into patients here.

    Socialized Medicine is not quite how some people perceive it to be. 'Rationed Treatments', is an entirely overblown and exaggerated opinion. It's certainly no different than being refused by insurance companies. And that's another thing, you don't HAVE to use the NHS. You can have private health insurance just like in the US. A lot of the times, it's the same doctors that work for the NHS, and often even at the same hospitals. You just get a better waiting room; one with a leather sofas and a cappuccino machine.

    A lot has to do with my own beliefs; that healthcare is a right, not a privilege. For me, it's different from just 'sponging off the government'. I wouldn't expect everyone to share my same passionate beliefs about healthcare; I wouldn't have chosen to study medicine if I didn't have these beliefs. If you're truly sick, you see a doctor. You can't plan for everything, and God forbid if something serious were to happen, you shouldn't be forced to make further life-changing decisions like, "should I sell the house to pay for treatment?" And yes, I know in the US that life-saving treatment MUST be given, but a serious life-changing condition does not have to be life-threatening to have a massive economic impact in one's life. And people still have to weigh out, "can I afford to get better" and I don't think that is an appropriate consideration to have to make.


    By all means, get lazy dead-beats off of welfare and back to work, keep the government out of our personal lives and stop terrorists from bombing our countries. But if someone's sick, treat them. End of.


    I'm not looking to really change anyone's strong socio-political views on the subject, I just wanted to bring my own experience to the table.


    On another note, Rip I have a lot of respect for you. I like what you do and how you do it. I've got your book, I've starting SS now and am loving it and looking forward to going every session. You've got a lot of followers here too. I only really realised this after I read up on SS and started noticing and asking the other guys at the gym. There's even some Crossfit guys here too. You bring some 'Texas charm' all the way here that I miss a lot from home. I look forward to the rest of the program. Thanks.


    -Sami

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sami View Post
    A lot has to do with my own beliefs; that healthcare is a right, not a privilege.
    What is a right, Sami? How can anything that compels another person to do anything be considered a right? Is food a right, a privilege, or a commodity?

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    What is a right, Sami? How can anything that compels another person to do anything be considered a right?
    With regards to the welfare system, I'd venture the following argument:

    Free healthcare is presented as a right (supposedly something we are all, as human beings, inalienably entitled to). It is, in fact though, a privilege, as it has been conferred on one segment of society by some higher authority, because that segment of society can't afford to pay for healthcare themselves.

    At the moment I am tending towards the view that welfare can be tailored to be a useful system, as long as the benefits it confers on any one individual are temporary, not lifelong. It should give you a chance to get back on your feet and work your way towards supporting yourself, if circumstances or bad luck have dealt you a bad hand.

    Maybe even this view is hopelessly naive though, I've been guilty of that before. Holes in my argument that I have spotted myself are; how temporary is temporary, and how bad must your bad luck be to qualify you for help?

  5. #25
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    Until we invent warp drive I'd prefer to keep my hard-earned money for use on more prudent things. Like bison meat.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sami View Post
    Socialized Medicine is not quite how some people perceive it to be.


    -Sami
    Even if it resulted in the best possible medical care for the most people, it still would do so by way of using the threat of force to extract property from people. Do you find those difficult to reconcile?

    That being said, none of the facts or statistics I hear about it leads me to believe it results in top-quality care.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    What is a right, Sami? How can anything that compels another person to do anything be considered a right? Is food a right, a privilege, or a commodity?
    The Universal Declaration of Human Rights, article 25 states:

    ?Everyone has the right to a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and the right to security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control.?

    Arguably, food is a right, privilege AND a commodity. There are, however, some circumstances where applying this statement is more accurate than others; vagrants don't have a right to a sirloin, but poor children have a right not to starve. Medical care is also a legal right, even in the US; which is why the Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act is in place, as well as the many other publically funded programs (Medicare, Medicaid, TRICARE etc.). The problem is that with all these different programs, organisations, divisions, rules and regulations, it leads to a lot of confusion, delays and inefficiencies. And it doesn't cover everyone.

    Another problem with this topic is definitions. How do you define health? How do you define healthcare, rights or entitlement? It's not so straight forward. But in practice, it's rather academic really. We all expect the police to protect our streets, schools to teach our children and construction workers to build our roads; taxes pay them to do so whether or not it's a right.

    From what I?ve gathered, there are a few big issues people have with a socialised model of healthcare are (more than the following):

    1) Financial Burden on Society:
    We are already taxed; nothing is going to change that. According to http://www.oecd.org/LongAbstract/0,3..._1_1_1,00.html, taxation for the US and UK is roughly the same for average earners; about 30% (It?s going to be higher for higher earners). But it?s where these funds are directed and how they?re used that matters. Yes, the NHS (uk national health service) is sometimes criticised for inefficiencies, but the US government spends more per person on healthcare than in any other country in the world yet medical access is nowhere near as good as it is in the UK.

    Instead of paying health insurance companies, you pay taxes. This enables you all the healthcare you need from any hospital or doctor you want. You don't have to worry about financial implications as I feel that shouldn't have to affect your health. Many working class families in the US struggle with healthcare costs; I know from experience. If you're not dirt poor or upper middle-class, it's extremely tough. I remember driving around back home in the US and seeing entire families at stop lights with buckets and posters collecting money for a seriously ill family member to cover the costs of treatment. Too many people fall through the net. Insurance premiums are rising 3 times faster than the rate of inflation! And Health Insurance companies are the devil, generally no one will deny this.

    2) Infringement of Liberty/Freedom for Doctors:
    Again, this is overblown. Doctors decide where and what they want to practice. They choose what speciality they want to train in, and apply for posts at the hospitals they want to work in. The NHS is the employer. If doctors want to have their own private practice, they can and do.



    I know that neither system is an ideal perfect solution, but for me the NHS is a better balance overall. What is it in particular that worries you about 'Socialised Medicine' (apart from the negative connotations that the word "socialism" may or may not imply)?

  8. #28
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    "YOU HAVE NO RIGHTS" - George Carlin

  9. #29
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    Mark,

    You could always go live in the Libertarian paradise of Somalia.... free of government intervention since 1991

    Zach

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sami View Post
    No Commercials: No, not to do with the government. We pay ?140 a year (per household) for a TV License which goes to the networks. Worth every penny not to have a show stopped every 4 minutes for commercials.
    Actually it goes to the BBC, which is owned by the government. Other channels, like ITV (which stands for Independent Television) are independent and as such have adverts. And if it's "worth every penny," why do the people who are selling it see fit to make it illegal not to pay it if you own a television set?

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