Skinny-> Skinny-Fat -> Viking

[fluxboy]

I've been vexed by this issue in the past. Other skinny guys have undoubtedly had issues with this. In fact, I'd say it's one of the most frequent cited reasons for going off a bulk program:

I'm getting too fat.

This hits the skinny guy harder, initially, because he likely accumulates bodyfat in the love handle region first. So a point will come where bodyfat will concentrate in the most unflattering of areas and the decision is almost always the same:

Cut back on eating, lifts go to shit, and depression reigns.

I believe I have a solution:

Eat more.

For skinny guys bulking up, keep aware that things will get worse before they get better. That initial flab is exaggerated on account of a rather artificially low bodyfat to begin with. The flab isn't an indication that you've eaten too much, it's an indication that you still have a long way to go before turning yourself into a strong man, it just feels horrible because the rest of the body hasn't been given a chance to fill and balance out. Your skinny-fat condition is a necessary stepping stone to becoming a proud Viking.

Skinny-> Skinny-Fat -> Viking

Open to discussion, I may be wrong.

Best,
Flux

[Mark Rippetoe]

I like the way Flux puts all this air in his posts. Spaces. Well, we're proud he's here.

[JaredLLL]

From reading about the Zone and from Robb Wolf and others, I understand that love handle flab to be an excess of carbs. which leads to a basketball for a belly and not fat on the arms, and you get skinny fat, since you dont have fat everywhere but lots around the belly.

So.... too much pasta, rice, and beer binging too, and not enough pork ( its one of my major food groups, and it should be yours too).

I know you meant it as words of encouragement, and often times the road through SS is retold through the indescriminate massive consumption of everything. Yet an understanding of why things are can help too!

Yet all the same, to go nuts on SS means not worrying about aesthetics for awhile, if you are skinny you are having a hard enough time shovelling down the food since you havn't been good at doing that up untill now. Just remember that the habits you form now, if they are bad, will have to be delt with later, so learn to love eating fat rather then loads of carbs. Beef Marrow anyone?

keyword: Syndrome X

[Konstantinos Kavos]

My new love-handles and gut haven't upset me. In fact, they are very useful. As someone who has to wear a suit every day to work, I can say that a dress shirt sits so much better when it has a small gut to wrap around.

Back in the days when I was skinny(er) and had a washboard stomach, even my made-to-measure shirts (an expensive habit) still folded and creased at the waist line.

Never again.

[MAD9692]

Thats exactly what happened to me. Unless I stay at the 208lb range all the extra weight just turns into an un-sightly gut.
However looking at Johnny Pain - he doesnt have a gut and he's up to 235lbs.
How did he do it?

[Steve Hill]

I've been thinking about this topic for a long time: Why is a caloric excess necessary to build muscle (and subsequently strength), and why is it so hard to build muscle or strength (or both) when you are not running a caloric excess?

I think the basic answer lies in the body's adaptive mechanism for survival. If there is no caloric excess, the body is not going to build muscle tissue that will metabolically require an even higher calorie count (which you are not giving it) to sustain. It will get by with the minimum to survive: it will try to adapt to the stress you are putting on it (or try to fail minimally at doing so) unless excess resources are given to it to adapt successfully.

So when you are running a caloric deficit, the body has to make a choice: do I use resources to try and build muscle that I will not be able to maintain, or do I cripple the damn fool a little so he'll stop doing this shit to me? Now, it may be possible to do this in the short-term, as long as the body has sufficient fat to burn to make up for the caloric deficit, and as long as sufficient protein is supplied, but eventually the body is going to look at it's dwindling supplies of fat and say "Yup, that's enough! No more strength for you!"

It's a pretty simple explanation, but I think it works. You can tell me I'm full of shit now.

[JLascek]

I hope he adds to the 70's Big Eating thread.

[fluxboy]

I like the way Flux puts all this air in his posts. Spaces. Well, we're proud he's here.

Thanks Rip, I like being here too.

Now, I see my post has been edited for brevity and good taste. I cannot fault this. Nonetheless, without tangible evidence, it may be difficult to sway my esteemed readers to the mighty side. Let's try some cool ASCII representations ...

Mr. Skinny walks into the gym:

___O___
.....!.....
.....!.....
....!.!....
.._!..!_..

After a few months of lifting and GOMAD, or even less, Mr. Skinny notices that while he has filled out a bit, his mid-section has as well. In fact, it's filled out too much. Mr.Skinny is now Mr.Skinny-Fat:

___O___
....\./....
....(.)....
....!.!....
.._!..!_..

Disheartened, he cuts back on the food intake, heads to T-Nation, loses strength, and ends up doing reverse leg curls and waxing his butt. In short order, Mr.Skinny-Fat returns to his original form. However, were he simply to keep with the program, adding weight, GOMAD-ing, and building strength, Mr.Skinny-Fat would not become Mr.Fat-Fat, he would become Mr.Viking:

\__O__/
...\.../...
....(.)....
....I.I....
.._I..I_..

The mistake most make at the skinny-fat point is the erroneous belief that the midsection will continue expanding at the same rate in relation to the rest of the physique. This does not happen. Rather, as your bodyfat increases it will spread to the rest of your body. It's as if the lower midsection reaches a set point, and then starts to fill out the upper abdomen area (like a balloon expanding), giving you a bulky battle-tank look.

Keep eating people.

Best,
Flux

[Jereth]

I started off quite skinny and put on too much fat on SS. I then simply cut my carb-intake after working out, ate slightly above maintanence and started doing some cardio twice a week.
Strangely, I started to break through my 'stuck' lifts after about two weeks whilst shedding some fat.
Even stranger, I'm heavier now than I was about 6 weeks ago with a reduced BF%(still not exaclty 'lean' however, but it's not a huge concern for me.

In short, yeah I actually tend to agree with you. I gathered some 'love handles' and my ass exploded(lots of work for the glutes with SS), but a small bit of effort sorted it out pretty quickly.

[Patrick]

I always thought Flux wanted to be sumo big? Lovehandles are the baby brother of the spare tire which is, in turn, the fledgling version of the true sumo adipose bodysuit. Oh well...

I think the vast majority of skinny people go through this same progression. When you first start you need to get a little fat to put on muscle or else you wouldn't have been skinny when you started. Once you get some size and strength you need to start cleaning things up because you don't have anymore quick muscular bodyweight gains left in your tank. After that you need to tighten things down still further to continue progression. At least in my mind I think of specificity in training just like specificity in diet -- the farther along you are the more fuss you need to make about the details.

FWIW, I can get fat pretty damn quickly. My solution has been to eat nearly uncomfortable amounts of fairly lean protein and figure out what works in around that. I seem to handle carbs fairly badly and maybe you're in the same position. But really, if you can tuck in to a huge salad, a mammoth slab of London Broil finished with butter and garlic, and some asparagus for dinner... who the hell needs pasta? Of course, there's no substitute for beer and anyone who says otherwise is selling something so you shouldn't listen.