spondylolisthesis + PC question

[Peter_k]

Hey Rip,

Have a couple questions if you don't mind.

1. One has to do with training people with spondylolisthesis. I've read previous threads on the topic, and the answer seems to be that squats, deadlifts and press are fine and probably beneficial, but they need to be done with care.

Could you elaborate more on what that means? My girlfriend has this problem and I'm not sure exactly how I should be helping her. I watch her form and try to make sure it looks kosher, but inevitably form breaks down at heavy weight. My main worry is with the press - she tends to hyperextend her back on very heavy sets. In this case, would she be wise to ditch the set if the bar speed slows down tremendously (i.e. instead of really grinding it through the sticking point)? I suppose progress could still be made, albeit at a slower pace.

2. The second has to do with cleans. I noticed that as the shrug happens one side is rising higher than the other due to a weakness and tightness in the trap (sort of like a winged scapula on one side - one shoulder is naturally lower and trap seems to have shortened). It kind of yanks something when I clean. Doesn't hurt very much, but doesn't feel great.

Do you think this could eventually resolve itself doing cleans since the body would want to adapt to it somehow? Also,I realize the "shrug" is really a passive motion, and I've heard some O-lifters even omit it completely. I'm just not sure how this works, or if I could learn how to do it. Have you ever taught someone to clean without the traps activating? It seems to me that you'd have to stop the pull prematurely. Just wondering because it may be a solution to this for me.

[Mark Rippetoe]

1. What grade is her spondy?

2. Sounds like a chiropractic deal. Can't comment without seeing it.

[Peter_k]

1. What grade is her spondy?

2. Sounds like a chiropractic deal. Can't comment without seeing it.

Guess I'll see a chiro. Been to an ART guy but they're not very helpful beyond loosening things up a bit.

As far as the spondy goes, she's not sure but it's definitely low level (hasn't bothered her in many years).

[Mark Rippetoe]

I'd be damn careful with her. Keep her back in as close to normal anatomical position as you can under a load. If she can't hold it there, take off some weight. This is not a thing to challenge with max loads. She has to train, yes, but she doesn't have to do 1RMs.