Basic Barbell Training for Endurance Athletes

[Mark Rippetoe]

I haven't worked with rowers, but I'm sure there are rowers who have worked with our method.

[Need2Lift]

For Need2Lift,
A friend of mine rowed for Canada at worlds, has coached national champions, rowed EARC (at Columbia) during his undergrad, and currently coaches provincial athletes while doing his PhD in the same program as me. I don't think it's just luck you did strength training the way you did. I showed him Rip's post on what he would have rowers do and he laughed, saying "Wow, I literally do the exact same thing with my athletes." They are big on presses for the shoulders and tend to avoid benching. To be fair, he said that there is disagreement in the community, but he is pretty adamant about this method.

We got it right with regard to the press vs. bench press, and I was in pretty phenomenal shape, but I still wish we'd continued to do cleans and deadlifts for all four years.

Rip's program seems good to me. It'd be interesting to see what kind of strength gains the guys would make given all the endurance training they'd also be doing.

[selters]

I was under the impression that a big limiting factor in most sports (of this nature) is having to haul your bodyweight about, but in rowing it effectively sits in the boat giving leverage with which to row harder, and the displacement/fluid resistance is minimally affected, which makes rowing a 'special case', so (if i'm correct) both argument standpoints hold merit.

Definitely. Many big, strong guys do pretty well in indoor short distance rowing competitions (indoor as in rowing on machine).

[Andras]

Definitely. Many big, strong guys do pretty well in indoor short distance rowing competitions (indoor as in rowing on machine).

One has to be careful comparing indoor rowing and on the water rowing. In either case I definitely agree with the statement that 10+lbs of mass that adds 100+ lbs to ones squat is a fast thing. The effect of total mass is different in rowing and erging.
On the erg, one doesn't really have to worry about one's momentum. Crank on the handle, and then let the slide roll one back down to the catch. Wash, rinse repeat. Then you notice if you pull yourself up the erg slide you can take another stroke faster, and get a better score. There are a bunch of other tricks you can play with your upper body that are considered bad on the water form, but they eeck out some extra power on the erg. Whatever you do the flywheel is either spinning freely or being driven by you. There is no penalty for extra (non working) weight, only a penalty for not driving the flywheel well.
The same is not true in the boat. You can't have your momentum crash down the slide faster than the boat is moving forward. The sliding seat slides to let the boat glide out in front of you much more than you roll down it. If you go down the slide too fast you jerk against the boat and slow it down. A simple guideline for power in a boat is the puddle from the Bowman’s oar should clear the coxswain before the next stroke. That has the boat moving forward ~30 ft for maybe 2 to 2.5 ft. of slide. This is a very different movement ratio than what is fast on the erg.
Also if you move around side to side that can slow you down (especially if it makes an oar hit the water). Others may want to chime in with better/different mechanical explanations of this.
Rowing is a power endurance sport, so training needs to both develop power and the endurance to apply that power over a 6+ minute time period.

Abenn, it would be interesting if you could get your friend to post some thoughts on how he runs his overall program... how much strength he is looking to develop and when/how he switches over to applying that strength? Does strength training change how he plans intervals work knowing he has stronger guys, or simply supplement it?

[tremorviolet]

Definitely. Many big, strong guys do pretty well in indoor short distance rowing competitions (indoor as in rowing on machine).

Ergs don't float.

I row competitively (currently training for Masters Nationals in OKC this August) and pretty much follow a textbook SS routing right now: squat/bench/dead (hanging leg raises/push-ups for the abz), squat/press/power clean (pull-ups/back ext) 2 or 3 times a week.

Being stronger has definitely helped my ability to maintain a stronger pull for longer. While the squat and power clean contribute significantly to strength and power, I find the deadlift most applicable to the rowing stroke. In the rowing stroke at the catch, you want to first drive the legs down and then swing the back. Most novices take the catch with the back and then drive the legs, called "opening up early" instead of maintaining back angle through the drive. Similar to the dead in that you keep the back angle relatively constant as you lift. You also don't straighten the legs while increasing the back angle to make it a stiff-legged deadlift which is equivalent to "shooting the slide" in rowing.