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  1. #21
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    • phoenix arizona seminar date
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    Enjoyed the discussion.

    You repeatedly mentioned rehabbing the injured part in the context of its normal use. When this is done, the healthy parts pick up the slack for the injured parts and the injured parts recover while being worked in their normal context.

    I would have enjoyed hearing your opinions about why using the part in context would enhance healing. I agree that it should be sort of obvious, but your thoughts on the subject would have been interesting. For example, what sort of neurological signalling occurs when an injured part continues to be used as normal, as opposed to being locked in position, or used unnaturally (like the hamstring curl). I thought about something I had heard many years ago that unilateral training of the unbroken arm speeds healing of the the broken, casted arm, presumably because of some sort of neurological signal that gets sent to the broken, casted arm, even though its in a cast.

    This seems so obvious, but Im sure you have some deeper thoughts...

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by FatButWeak View Post
    For example, what sort of neurological signalling occurs when an injured part continues to be used as normal, as opposed to being locked in position, or used unnaturally (like the hamstring curl). I thought about something I had heard many years ago that unilateral training of the unbroken arm speeds healing of the the broken, casted arm, presumably because of some sort of neurological signal that gets sent to the broken, casted arm, even though its in a cast.
    That phenomenon, referred to as "crosstraining", has never proven to be an important part of rehab that is actively used in Physical Therapy. But your question about innervation is important, since it provides further reasoning for our approach. If the innervation is not damaged, the injured muscle belly is receiving 2 forms of signalling in the process of being used in its normal context: contractile signalling, which makes it fire the motor units involved, and pain, which acts to protect the area from firing. If the pain can be worked through -- because of a degree of healing, the use of light-enough weight, and the ability of the rest of the system to unload the injured component sufficiently to permit its motor units to fire anyway -- the area is worked, is bathed in accumulated lactate during the set (again, I've seen references to this, but I'm not sure of the precise mechanism -- it has been my experience that this is a significant factor), does not have time to scar down, and returns much more rapidly to normal function.

    If the innervation is damaged, contraction is not possible due to the lack of an ability to fire the involved motor units. Homework: ask a PT how they "rehab" a scapular wing, and why this would work in the presence of the neurological defect that causes the problem.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by hsilman View Post
    I find this very encouraging. I've been dealing with some kind of tendon related pain in my left knee for the past 8-9 months. It hasn't gotten any worse since about 2 months in, but it hasn't really gotten better. However, I can train through it with a light knee wrap(ace bandage) and my rehbands. Hopefully it eventually just clears up like your injury.
    I hope so too. Your comment reminds me of something a doctor once told me. If a condition is worsening it is probably worth seeing a a doctor, if it's stable then watch it. If it is improving you are good to go. In the case of my elbow pain there were times when it was really terrible, in fact some of the worst pain I have ever felt in my coddled life. I didn't workout at those times.

    I'm currently watching an issue with back pain that i have had for about five years. I have noticed as my squat is going up my back feels better during the day. That is surprising to me because i thought whatever improvement back strength would make it would have already made it before I started SS. Appears. I was wrong. I may never be completely free of pain, but I am 41 after all. One has to be realistic about these things.

    Good luck with your knee pain.

  4. #24
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    If I understood correctly, most of what you said applies to muscle belly tears. It would be interesting to hear your thoughts on rehabbing injuries to ligaments, tendons, and cartilage. From what I've read about how jockeys rehab fractures, they follow a similar active rehab approach--get the bone set correctly, let it knit over a bit, and then get it moving as soon as possible. But the advice I've seen on active rehab of (partial) tendon tears was more conservative: do some isometric contraction of the muscle that is attached to the injured tendon, in order to allow the new collagen fibers to align correctly instead of forming a scar. But if eccentric/concentric contractions under load are not a good idea for tendon tears, that doesn't seem to leave a lot of options for barbell work. Would you agree? And what about cartilage injuries?

  5. #25
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    This has been discussed at length. Use the SEARCH FUNCTION.

  6. #26
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    [Tobo the injured dog limps off to lick wounds]

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    I'm not sure of the precise mechanism
    I was able to find this: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2443402/, which has some discussion on the subject.

  8. #28
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    Regarding elbow issues, I've had golfer's elbow since I started squatting (long forearms relative to the upper arm). I use a low resistance hand gripper 3x20 in the morning and 3x20 in the evening, and this helps quite a bit. I've also had tennis elbow show up since starting to program pull ups. The hand gripper seems to help with that as well, although it could simply be that improvement in the pull ups is the primary contributor.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by stef View Post
    We're keeping the podcasts to an approximate time
    Unless that's necessary to restrict costs or something, I wouldn't bother. We'll listen for longer. If it goes on past an hour you might want to break it up the way you did the conversations with Dan John, etc. But we'll listen. Quality encourages attention.

    It's interesting Rip mentions a guy coming into the gym 9 months past an ACL repair still limping. I've a friend who's five years past one and still limping. As well, at my gym a colleague has been more than 12 months on crutches, and there are at least dozens of people who have been dutifully doing their shoulder internal/external banded rotations and shoulder scaptions and so on for years and are still in pain. None of them squat, deadlift, bench press or row (whether light or heavy, with barbells or dumbbells or whatever), or if they do them it's a much shortened range of motion.

    From my experience, Rip is actually understating the problem of physiotherapy not working very well.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle Aaron View Post
    Unless that's necessary to restrict costs or something, I wouldn't bother. We'll listen for longer. If it goes on past an hour you might want to break it up the way you did the conversations with Dan John, etc. But we'll listen. Quality encourages attention.
    Agree. The Joe Rogan Experience is usually more than 2 hrs twice a week sometimes three hours, and it is a huge success, one of the top rated in iTunes, and a tremendous asset to his brand. If you are loving the conversation, the material is fascinating, and the material is naturally filling the time, then let it rip, Rip.

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