The Mainstream Media and Drinking: How did they agree on this particular lie???

[Mark Rippetoe]

How do you guys think drinking effects your training? At 36, I feel that a little drink here and there doesn't hurt, but 2-4 drinks a day would definitely have a negative effect on my training. I know people who drink more and still get great results, but usually it is the other "supplementation" that helps a lot. Those probably don't help with the longevity though. :-)

Alcoholism is bad for your training and everything else. But I set several big PRs when I was hungover.

[medwards]

It is rather ironic that the sections of Christianity that demonizes alcohol tends to be the Bible-only folks and from the Anabaptist traditions. You could probably make a pretty accurate case for the closer your church looks like the Roman Catholics or Greek Orthodox, the more booze that parishioners are consuming.

Anabaptists became Mennonites and Amish of today, modern Baptists are from a different tradition. Is that what you meant?

I understand that temperance is a development of fundamentalism. The idea was to put some distance between the faithful and the larger culture. To not just avoid sin, but to avoid things that might lead to sin, dancing, smoking, drinking, etc. much like the Pharisees attempted to keep the Law by adding more traditions on top of it.

[tertius]

How do you guys think drinking effects your training? At 36, I feel that a little drink here and there doesn't hurt, but 2-4 drinks a day would definitely have a negative effect on my training. I know people who drink more and still get great results, but usually it is the other "supplementation" that helps a lot. Those probably don't help with the longevity though. :-)

That's just because you're out of practice.

You can train your drinking through progressive overload, like many things.

Back in my drinkingest days, I got into the habit of consuming a fifth or so of 100 proof bourbon (Knob Creek, typically) in an evening. Out of the bottle, because I'm classy. I typically would not be that drunk, nor be very hungover the next day. And that was at a weight of less than a 150 pounds.

Because I worked up to that over many months, and my liver was ready to deal with the alcohol because my cytochrome P450 and anti-oxidant game was upregulated (something which may play a role in the positive effects of moderate drinking, maybe?).

If I tried to do that now, I'd be a total, utter wreck a quarter of the way into the bottle.

[Mark Rippetoe]

That shit is Jim Beam, you know.

[wal]

I suspect the church's position will quietly change over the next generation or two.

I suspect there will not be a next generation or two.

The one given is that death will come for us all sooner or later

Well, thats not entirely correct, some of us will escape death.

Alcoholism is bad for your training and everything else. But I set several big PRs when I was hungover.

Well you could say that, however I would tend to think that perhaps, just maybe, the hangover actually retarded what might have been an even bigger PR, but due to your determination and sheer brute strength you overcame a severe case of zugzwang.

[tertius]

That shit is Jim Beam, you know.

And a huge volume of the "craft" whiskey out there is made in Lawrenceburg, IN on giant column stills.
I don't care that much who makes it, or how (though I'd prefer not to be lied to). I care about how it tastes.

Knob Creek is superior to Maker's, which is what all my friends drank, and it used to be really cheap. $22 a fifth, once upon a time.
It's a pretty good whiskey for that price. A hell of a lot better than things slightly cheaper. I also drank Elijah Craig fairly frequently.
Tend to prefer higher proof bourbons.

[wal]

Not to rehash an older discussion but refer to item #3 of post #12 of this topic ( I am not computer savvy enough to handle multiple quotes in a response). Jesus went to parties. Jesus was cool enough to be invited to parties. Jesus drank alcohol. When the party ran out of drink, he got more and better stuff. So teetotaling is not a basic tenet for Christians. There is something to be said for that old time religion.

If teetotaling has a religious base it is a feature of that group, not a universal mandate for Christians. Thank you Jesus.

What about thanking Him for something that is infinitely more valuable? The gift of eternal life.

[ecj]

No doubt they would. But Day's Catholic Workers Organization was as representative of mainstream Catholic thinking and practice as Opus Dei. Both representing polar opposites in political alignment but which ignore the much larger mushy middle (albeit generally socially conservative) of Catholics.

It's interesting you talk about Addams. In all the things I learned about her as a kid, her religious alignment was never talked about. Just her secular concerns for the poor. I had to do some on the spot looking up of her background to find some Presbyterian linkages for her. Not that I disbelieved you, but my response was huh? Since when? I do know that her religious alignments and convictions got very short shrift when her good works were described in the history classes I had in school. Since Hull House was in Chicago she was not exactly ignored in my Illinois textbooks.

In any event, I cede your point to be materially correct, although they seemed to have little wide spread influence during the times of their works. The Berrigan Brothers and their like were a whole other matter during the Big Bad Nam. Their leftism and their religiosity were inextricably linked. Them being priests and all.

They were all part of the "social Christian" movement. I think you're wrong about the timeline here. Addams was definitely outspokenly Christian, as were most of the settlement house movement founders in the USA. Her buddy Graham Taylor who opened the settlement house adjacent to Hull was even a professor at the UoC Seminary.

You also have to remember the historical legacy of preachers like Preston Bradley who were certainly ardently Christian and leftist.

I think I'm more than "materially correct" in indicating that there has been a very strong religious left-wing movement in the USA for more than 100 years, at least.

[John Watson]

The Bill Starr article on training with a hangover is quite interesting.

http://startingstrength.com/index.ph...r#.VBBmRxbb5yw

Most surprising is the effect of training on an LSD trip.

[Mark Rippetoe]

What about thanking Him for something that is infinitely more valuable? The gift of eternal life.

There's no such thing, wal.

And a huge volume of the "craft" whiskey out there is made in Lawrenceburg, IN on giant column stills.
I don't care that much who makes it, or how (though I'd prefer not to be lied to). I care about how it tastes.

Lies are an integral part of the American whiskey industry. Buy this book: http://www.amazon.com/Kings-County-D...dp/1419709909/

Knob Creek is superior to Maker's, which is what all my friends drank, and it used to be really cheap. $22 a fifth, once upon a time.
It's a pretty good whiskey for that price. A hell of a lot better than things slightly cheaper. I also drank Elijah Craig fairly frequently.
Tend to prefer higher proof bourbons.

Maker's is Beam Inc. too.