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Thread: Kettlebell & Barbells...

  1. #91
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    • wichita falls texas march seminar date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fajita_McJones View Post
    Hold up, force is still that shit you need to change the motion of an object, right? Either to make it move, make it move faster, change its direction, slow it down or stop it, right?

    KE= m/2 x v^2, or kinetic energy equals mass divided by 2 times velocity squared. That means that we cause an object to produce more kinetic energy by affecting the velocity of an object (via the force we apply to it causing it to accelerate) than we can by just making the object heavier. And making an object produce more kinetic energy requires more energy from us, right? Or is there a glitch in the Matrix? Should bullets move the speed of a barbell squat instead of much faster?

    This must have been covered in the part of the thread where I also asked about 1RM deadlifts, because I can't find that either.
    I may be misunderstanding a few things here, but as others have stated, it seems you're overlooking the fact that force produced quickly is different than force produced more slowly. If all you care about is the amount of force produced in the PC and deadlift - and you're not concerned about the fact that one is a display of power, while the other isn't nearly as much - then, yes, you can do a conservation-of-energy analysis. In that analysis you use the change of potential energy, not the kinetic energy.

    I haven't included the analysis because it looks ugly, it's an over-simplification (not sure about this), and it completely ignores the concept of power.

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by dpg View Post
    Is it any surprise that the group that trained with conventional weights twice a week improved their conventional lifts more than the group that trained with kettlebells twice a week (since the barbell group got to train using the kind of lifts they would be tested on)? What if they ran the same study but tested the kettlebell lifts instead of the barbell lifts? Wouldn't the group that trained on the kettlebells have improved more? And the study would have concluded that kettlebells are more effective that barbells. It would be useful to know how much each group's kettlebell lifts improved during the same period. That way we could see how much each tool carries over into performance with the other tool. Dan John and Pavel (who are mentioned in the article) have written about a "What the Hell" effect, where including kettlebells in the training regimen seems to produce inexplicable increases on the barbell lifts and in athletic performance. But I agree with the article's main point that barbells are tops for building strength. But the article also went on to say that kettlebells are useful for developing other qualities such as power, endurance, and mobility, which are useful to athletes as well as the recreational trainee. No one advocating kettlebells is saying that the barbell is not an effective. But that's exactly what some barbell fundamentalists are saying about the kettlebell. It's not an either/or proposition, but rather it could be a both/and proposition, for those who are so inclined.
    Why are you here, dpg? To say that everybody is right and nobody is wrong?

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    Why are you here, dpg? To say that everybody is right and nobody is wrong?
    Kumbaya, my Rip. Kumbaya.

  4. #94
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    I thought kettlebells were mostly for exercise, not really for training. With maybe the exception of whatever Turkish get-ups train. Body contortion? The ability to tolerate pain? As someone who hates to do sprints, the idea of doing cardio or conditioning with weights appeals to me. In fact, having only a barbell, no kettlebells, I have decided that if I do any conditioning, it'll be crazy ass bullshit with my barbell. But I'd be willing to use a big kettlebell, too, if I had one.

  5. #95
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    Default Strength training for girevoy sport

    Girevoy sport involves lifting kettlebells for 10 minutes. Whoever makes more reps wins. The lifts: one arm snatch, two arm jerk or two arm clean&jerk (re-cleaning the bells every rep). That's the sport.

    The template often includes (after warm-up) a working set or two with heavier kettlebells, 4 - 6 minutes long, followed by one 10 minute set with lighter kettlebells. After that it's circuits. An example: four rounds of BB front squats - BB presses - pull-ups - abdominal exercise.

    How would you incorporate/structure strength training for this sport?

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by hsilman View Post
    I don't understand the complication or why everyone wants to make this some kind of sport specific thing.
    Assuming you're sincere in your reply I will answer this. Adding extra training volume on top of training for the main sport interferes with recovery and may result in reduced gains of the sport. Another issue - concomitant training of strength and endurance, them affecting each other. A coach with experience of training endurance athletes would understand the context of my question.

  7. #97
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    Man, if you're looking for experienced coaching advice regarding strength training and sports, you've come to the wrong place. Sorry.

  8. #98
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    Not even an opinion?

  9. #99
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    Man, I've never even thought about this. Over my head.

  10. #100
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    starting strength coach development program
    The cluelessness - it burns!

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