Probably Silly BS, but I'll ask anyhow...

[hollowpond]

Hey Coach. I've got a quick question. My youngest son (14) plays baseball and his coach is super interested in what I've done to put weight on him (SSLP and feeding him plenty of real food). That is until I start telling him what I've done. "Baseball players don't need to do overhead presses!! We do bench presses, but we fold a towel and put it on our chest...we don't touch the bar to our chest."

None of that is really surprising, but my question is this; Could HEAVY pressing have an effect on throwing with maximum velocity?

The ONLY reason I ask is because I have read several articles suggesting that it could (I suspect silly BS in most of these articles), and more importantly I have noticed that when I am throwing with him I will throw my arm out in a skinny minute nowadays. My presses aren't huge (315 BP, 202.5 press) and I suspect my being an old fart might have something to do with it, but it does make me say "hmmmmm..."

Again, I highly suspect silly BS especially at the strength level these kids are at (non-existent), but with my own experiences I can't help but wonder if there could be something to this. At least once they were to move to mid/late intermediate programming. I guess I just want justification for my thinking.

Thanks...

[Mark Rippetoe]

What is the reasoning behind their assertion that presses reduce throwing velocity? Provide the details.

[hollowpond]

They don't think it reduces velocity. They think it affects mobility and makes them injury prone. The worst part is...they can't explain why!! Even the articles I read just basically said, "just trust us, we don't do presses."

I wouldn't even bother you with this shit, if it were not for my own experience. I care more about getting my press to 225 than throwing a baseball, so I honestly don't care, but my son is a baseball fanatic. For right now I honestly don't think it makes a difference. He presses 85 lbs for sets of 5. I just don't want my bias to screw him when shit does get heavy (a long time from now) and wanted to see how you would come down on this...

[Mark Rippetoe]

"Just trust us, we don't do presses" is not much to argue with.

[Jeff Illingworth]

I have only worked with one baseball player, a pitcher, through lp and into intermediate programming. We saw no injuries, but did add four miles an hour to her pitch.

[spacediver]

personal anecdote that may or may not be relevant here. Earlier this year I got my press up to 159 for doubles. Body weight roughly 192 lb. 40 years old. I didn't experience any detrimental effects on my tennis serve (which is essentially an upwards throwing motion), and I've got a fairly big serve.

Maybe the benching caused an injury that is sensitive to explosive throwing motions? Maybe a throwing technique issue, or lack of warmup?

Maybe you weren't recovered enough from the stress of the workout to perform?

I suppose if you gained enough weight in your arms, that might have an effect (the internal and external rotators now have to accelerate/decelerate a larger mass), but this is just idle speculation on my part.

All of the above would be more sensitive to aging.

Do you recall being able to throw without aggravation when you weren't significantly younger than today, yet were substantially smaller/weaker?

[pbrennan]

Over the last 3 years I have dealt with several pitchers that will likely make significant amounts of money pitching in their lifetime. Each were vastly different in build and style of pitching. All I know is that properly pressing them overhead progressively improved their shoulder mobility. From what I have seen at the high school level, the baseball culture for S&C is the worst. "Experts" charging kids $400 for a function movement screen to tell kids their shoulders are weak/and have limited range of motion and then give them an 8 week "program" that consists of hex bar deadlifts and shoulder PT exercises. They never advertise the JV pitcher they work with, only the big time recruits or pro's. The kids I get that go to those "experts" are traditionally the worst lifters and have no control or postural awareness. 8 weeks on an LP they are usually fixed. It's hard to say what the work in the weightroom once they get to us did for them, because they are already national level pitchers when they get here. To make a long story short, doing what you are doing is best to help to develop your son. Keep it up.

[Royce Nichols]

While there are many contributing factors to pitchers getting injuries, one of my guesses is that weak shoulders one of them and that the best way to them healthy (in addition to proper rest, mechanics, etc) is to get them strong. The injury rate among pitchers these days, especially kids is ABSURD these days. I wouldn’t listen to a damn thing they said.

[hollowpond]

Agreed. Hence my throwing my hands up here.

So I guess the general consensus is to just throw my hands up in the air and keep doing presses until there is an issue? (Which has been my plan anyways.)

Unlike most baseball dads I have no illusions of my son going as a D1 baseball player. At least he'll be strong as hell by the time his baseball career in high school is over.

While looking for an article as an example I stumbled on this...
Overhead Pressing for Baseball Players/Throwers

Yeah...we'll just do the damn presses. Thanks for your time, Coach!

[Mike Powers]

How could strengthening(is that a word?)every assest and aspect of the human body be a bad thing?As a catcher in my younger days,i didn't lift then,we were told to stay away from wiffle ball and stickball because it will affect throwing.I think the whole weightlifting is bad for baseball comes from the gigantic BB look.The muscled up 'roid heads of the 80's and 90's didn't do to bad.Nor do the fat assed slobs you see on the mound now.I would think OHP would be quite beneficial to strengthinning a throwers arm and all the muscles,tendons and bone structure?