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Thread: I stopped going to the gym because of Trump. Now I can't open jars

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scaldrew View Post
    Trump saying he grabbed a woman by the P-word... no! No, that's just--that's just--that's just distasteful!
    More importantly, that's not what he said. This is, of course, irrelevant to them.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark E. Hurling View Post
    Only if you are too young or were not paying attention during the term(s) of Nixon, Ford, Reagan, or either Bush.
    Yes, I am young and not a North American, so what I talk about is pretty much how I remember worldwide mainstream media coverage since George W Bush.

    W was pretty much considered an idiot and incompetent by the general public, but the media coverage treated him like "today the US president did this and that" and that was it.

    Obama received zero negative criticism, both from the media and the general public. Whenever there was something bad coming from the US it was portraied as "typical american shit". Anything good was a fruit of The Obama administration.

    Now onto Trump. Every single day since Trump's name became big in the presidential race, all of the brazilian TV news channels have devoted 10 to 15 minutes to talk about Trump and the Russia stuff/rise of the far right/racism/xenophobia. Every journalist after talking about Trump will make a cynical face and throw a "this is the end of times" remark. Only on this past month that Trump bashing has subsided because we were focusing on the World Cup and our own presidential elections. We have our own "Hitler" candidate as well.

  3. #23
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    The Media is essentially universal now, and they are essentially unanimous in this propaganda campaign. As I've said before, if you dislike Trump now, just wait till he's a Martyr.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luke S View Post
    Yes, I am young and not a North American, so what I talk about is pretty much how I remember worldwide mainstream media coverage since George W Bush.
    That's OK. Unless you work to overcome recency, all history begins for young 'uns around age 14 or so. That's when they first encounter an edgy and progressive history teacher who tells them that everything they think they know and that their parents told them is wrong and only for benighted squares to continue to believe.

    Quote Originally Posted by Luke S View Post
    W was pretty much considered an idiot and incompetent by the general public, but the media coverage treated him like "today the US president did this and that" and that was it.
    So then how, pray tell, did your non-North American cohort of the Truly Intelligent general public arrive at that conclusion? Absent the benefit of a media that didn't like him in the first place? Like say, when the Swedes decided to moon W. Was that done by a flash mob via osmosis or some collective spontaneous hive mind?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    More importantly, that's not what he said. This is, of course, irrelevant.
    The quote is:

    Trump: "Grab ’em by the pussy. You can do anything."

    Out of context, this is equivalent of someone who says, “Grab ‘em by the balls. You can do anything.” Which is, by far, the more commonly used expression.

    In the context of the surreptitious recording, Trump precedes this by saying he “just kisses” woman. So it is possible that he actually has done this. Kissing and pussy grabbing. It’s also possible that he hasn’t but wants to. It’s also possible that he was using a metaphor for being aggressive with woman.

    The latter possibility being the most rational interpretation.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    More importantly, that's not what he said. This is, of course, irrelevant to them.
    It’s interesting to me.

    Full transparency, I do not like Trump. I do not
    like Hillary or any other candidate this past election cycle. I’ve voted both republican and democratic in the past. I’m 54.

    I think at times Trump does act like a petulant child and I don’t like petulance....or children.

    I’ve heard MANY people say Trump is racist. I don’t participate in these discussions because the net/net for my life is zero (and I’ve heard that I’m a Trump supporter because I did not denounce him). But it got me thinking. What evidence is there that’s he’s actually racist? He’s certainly been accused a great deal. In my independent research, I’ve found that he’s actually been very well received by non-white communities in the past.

    It wasn’t until he became a republican political candidate when the racist claims came out.

    Then there’s the “he empowers white supremists.” His “there are good people on both sides” comment was probably better left unsaid, but once it was, the narrative was cemented and he’s a “supporter or empowerer of white supremacy.”

    I shave my head and I’m white and I love metal and I have tattoos. I shudder to think I could be labeled as a supporter of white (or any other race) supremacy. I don’t care if you are fucking purple. If you’re a good person you’re cool in my book. But reason has no place here now.

    The point is, I’m so worried about what’s happening these days. All you have to do is be accused*. Then you’re labeled forever. One’s livelihood will be in jeopardy. In the case of Trump, I still don’t like him but I’ll never accuse him of being a racist or a supporter of white supremacy. Until I meet him and he tells me he’s both, it’s not a concern to me.

    It’s become clear the immense power of the media and the new media- social media- to create and foster group think. Fringe voices are now made whole. Which is very dangerous. There is no hope. The homesteaders in the Alaskan wilderness were right all along...

    * thank god netflix’ corporate culture has mandated the 5 second rule for eye contact in their offices #metoo

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnst_nhb View Post
    It wasn’t until he became a republican political candidate when the racist claims came out.
    This is also the best, fastest way to become Hitler.

    I'm just glad Hitler, himself never caught onto this. He might have started much earlier and might have been more successful. Fortunately the Dems had their hands full with their Klan meeting and such at the time.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luke S View Post
    W was pretty much considered an idiot and incompetent by the general public, but the media coverage treated him like "today the US president did this and that" and that was it..
    Not that anyone will believe this assessment of President GW Bush's intelligence if they're predisposed not to, here's a viewpoint from Keith Hennessey who was the Director of the U.S. National Economic Council under Bush and who now teaches at Stanford:

    George W. Bush is smarter than you – Keith Hennessey

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by hostile View Post
    i don't mean this as a challenge, I'm just curious: are you disputing that he actually grabbed women by the pussy, mocked a reporters disability, promised to build a wall, or called mexicans rapists?

    Or are you disputing her implication that these behaviors are somehow not befitting of a president?
    Regarding grabbing women by the pussy, he said that when you're famous, they let you do it. So he was at least arguably referring to the things that women will consent to a famous man doing. I find it interesting that even in this MeToo era, the women who before the election claimed he misbehaved with them have disappeared. It makes those claims seem to me like they were politically motivated, and dropped after the election--the moment of their potential usefulness--passed.

    Mocking a reporter's disability--the gestures Trump used are gestures he has used on other occasions to to indicate someone acting stupid and flustered. He's even used them about himself. There's video.

    Mexico is a country with horrible crime problems and widespread attitudes about women that we would consider retrograde (e.g. age of consent=12). The lawlessness of the border, e.g. human and drug trafficking, and the rampant sexual assault against migrants as they make their way through Mexico to the U.S., is well-known. We do not keep good records in this country of the nationality and immigration status of criminals, so it is hard to say definitively whether there is actually a higher proportion of rapists among Mexican illegal immigrants than among society at large. But it stands to reason that if lots of people are coming in from a highly criminal and misogynistic society, some of those people will bring the criminality and misogynistic attitudes with them--while others will be good people.

    Someone else in this thread mentioned the very fine people on both sides comment about Charlottesville. Let's dust off our SAT verbal reasoning: to say that there were not some very fine people among the pro-confederate-statute marchers in Charlottesville is to say that none of the 500 or so marchers were very fine people. Any SAT prep coach will tell you that "all" or "none" answers need special scrutiny. Are we sure that none of the marchers were very fine people? That of the 500 marchers there was not a single person who, say, had ancestors who died fighting for the confederacy, and who is not racist but who sincerely thought statue-removal was a bad idea?

    The media twisted this into Trump saying that white supremacists are very fine people, but that isn't what he said--in fact in the same statement he condemned white supremacists.

    With Trump, as is so often the case, "It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so."

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by JFord View Post
    Not that anyone will believe this assessment of President GW Bush's intelligence if they're predisposed not to, here's a viewpoint from Keith Hennessey who was the Director of the U.S. National Economic Council under Bush and who now teaches at Stanford:

    George W. Bush is smarter than you – Keith Hennessey
    Damned good article. Pull quote:

    Every prominent politician has a public caricature, one drawn initially by late-night comedy joke writers and shaped heavily by the press and one’s political opponents. The caricature of President Bush is that of a good ol’ boy from Texas who is principled and tough, but just not that bright.
    Read it all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    "Calvin" apparently quite literally hates a man he has never met, a man who has not harmed him or anyone he knows personally, and his foam-flecked keyboard demonstrates this daily. If he had the balls, his input indicates that he would kill Donald Trump, so vicious are his deranged ravings. There are millions like him, pious believers in Trump's evil and their own holiness for opposing him.
    Example:

    Quote Originally Posted by Calvin View Post
    The Rubicon was crossed with the cheering for child abuse. Trump and his red hatted morons have shown the world what they are. Enjoy being on the wrong side of history. I won't be around much going forward as I don't intentionally spend time talking to garbage people. Enjoy your Trumpet apology circles.
    Now, I understand that this person is mentally ill. But how much different is he/she from James T. Hodgkinson? Don't know who that is? I wonder why.

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