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Thread: RPE

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    Eventually, you see, RPE becomes data. It's a technology. Despite the fact that after 42 years of training, I cannot always tell if the last rep of a set will go back up until I do the rep. The fact is that RPE is a way to manage clients in online training -- like the 30-visit chiropractor, it is a business model, and that is all it is. And you fools have swallowed the bait.

    As I said, this thread will not go 11 pages. If all you people are going to do is reiterate the same tired shit you always post, we're done. Talk about something else.
    I’ve never done any online training or used RPE but, how do you manage clients in online training?.

  2. #32
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    Rippetoe is right. This conversation is going “know” where😜. My main point is this stuff is not knew. It’s repackaged percentages. Even on squat variation or deadlift variation you won’t improve what that variation is supposed to make better if you don’t get challenged by it. You really do have to get under the bar and man up!! It took me along time to realize that. Y’all would do well to understand that sooner.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    I’ve never done any online training or used RPE but, how do you manage clients in online training?.
    You don't have to give them numbers other than RPE. You don't have to tell them the weight on the bar for each workout. You place the responsibility for deciding the loads on the client, not the coach. This saves quite a bit of time. It allows you to sell a template that applies to almost everybody, especially if you insist that "there is no evidence that older lifters cannot do the same volume" as everybody else. All percentage tables are bullshit, and so is RPE, as Fat observes.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    You don't have to give them numbers other than RPE. You don't have to tell them the weight on the bar for each workout. You place the responsibility for deciding the loads on the client, not the coach. This saves quite a bit of time. It allows you to sell a template that applies to almost everybody, especially if you insist that "there is no evidence that older lifters cannot do the same volume" as everybody else. All percentage tables are bullshit, and so is RPE, as Fat observes.
    My apologies for not being clear. I’m not arguing for RPE. I meant how does Starting Strength manage it’s online clients?. Video of worksets?.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    I’ve never done any online training or used RPE but, how do you manage clients in online training?.
    I know this thread and this question can go many different ways but here is one viewpoint. It depends how often they submit videos. I have one client who is mid-intermediate. He comes in for in person form checks once a month and only submits vids when he feels he needs feedback or something doesn't feel right. I have him notate what he thought the RPE was of his sets. This happens AFTER the set though. I do not tell him to do a top triple at RPE 9 and then a back off set of 5 at RPE 7 or something like that. He doesn't get to pick what weight to use based on how he thinks it feels. If someone is a novice or early intermediate and you are seeing every work set and how the bar is moving then there is no need to discuss RPE whatsoever.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnW View Post
    My apologies for not being clear. I’m not arguing for RPE. I meant how does Starting Strength manage it’s online clients?. Video of worksets?.
    I don't have any online clients. Startingstrengthonlinecoaching.com is a referral service for SSCs to manage their online training the way they see fit. They all know my position on the subject.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Arnold View Post
    I know this thread and this question can go many different ways but here is one viewpoint. It depends how often they submit videos. I have one client who is mid-intermediate. He comes in for in person form checks once a month and only submits vids when he feels he needs feedback or something doesn't feel right. I have him notate what he thought the RPE was of his sets. This happens AFTER the set though. I do not tell him to do a top triple at RPE 9 and then a back off set of 5 at RPE 7 or something like that. He doesn't get to pick what weight to use based on how he thinks it feels. If someone is a novice or early intermediate and you are seeing every work set and how the bar is moving then there is no need to discuss RPE whatsoever.
    In other words, Ryan uses the term descriptively instead of prescriptively. I'd rather see it not used at all, to avoid confusion.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diddyin94 View Post
    I have a really hard time even bothering to engage with someone who wouldn't spend $50 on PPST to further their training. Says a lot about you.
    Then it's a good thing I DID buy it ?

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    You don't have to give them numbers other than RPE. You don't have to tell them the weight on the bar for each workout. You place the responsibility for deciding the loads on the client, not the coach. This saves quite a bit of time. It allows you to sell a template that applies to almost everybody, especially if you insist that "there is no evidence that older lifters cannot do the same volume" as everybody else. All percentage tables are bullshit, and so is RPE, as Fat observes.
    ^^^^^^ now that makes perfect sense. It differentiates other business models from SS and is a fast track to easier revenue. In the end it's a business, but there has to be a sense of integrity about a business, it cannot be just the money.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark E. Hurling View Post
    I'm old, and I frequently hurt from old injuries and arthritis and a recently developed trigger finger condition. If you let yourself be guided just by how sore or tired or unrecovered you FEEL you are, you are accepting a lesser performance. Or, as you get old, letting The Reaper steal a march on you.
    Except that isn't how RPE is used. You don't pre-emptively overrate RPE because you feel sore or old or injured or tired or whatever. You attempt the planned weights. You rate RPE descriptively after each set. Maybe you hit the expected weight for the expected RPE, maybe you don't. Maybe those factors impact performance on that day, maybe they don't. Maybe RPE is lower than expected and your work sets are heavier than planned.

    In concept, this is not all that different to finding our weight in the first workouts described in SSBBT

    For the squat, we we are told "go on up in weight ... until you can tell that the next jump up would alter you form."

    The press "until the bar speed begins to slow markedly on the fifth rep of the set, and call it a workout."

    Deadlift "If you’re sure your form is good enough, add weight for a few sets until it feels like the next increase might be a problem, and that’s the first deadlift workout."

    Or bench "add weight a little at a time ... until the bar speed begins to slow down and your form starts to change. Stay there for two more sets of five, and that is the first workout."

    None of these feelings are "guided just by how sore or tired or unrecovered you FEEL you are", but all require some kind of prediction of what might happen in the immediate future based on the current set.

    If a novice is capable of sufficiently accurately predicting what might happen on a next set (that isn't attempted), then I don't see why it is so hard for people to accept that lifters can accurately predict what might happen on a next rep (that isn't attempted)


    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    You don't have to tell them the weight on the bar for each workout. You place the responsibility for deciding the loads on the client, not the coach. This saves quite a bit of time. It allows you to sell a template that applies to almost everybody, especially if you insist that "there is no evidence that older lifters cannot do the same volume" as everybody else.
    How is any of this different to the novice template in SSBBT? Do the above limitations affect the success rate of the program?

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrflibble View Post
    How is any of this different to the novice template in SSBBT? Do the above limitations affect the success rate of the program?
    This cannot be a serious question. The first workout of the NLP is not the method used subsequently in the NLP, and I am surprised that you would be so bought in to RPE-babble that you would say something this amazing and transparent a mischaracterization. Grasping at straw men. Desperation. Just stop typing why you retain a shred of your intellectual dignity.

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