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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    It's the big words.
    Its because it looks like a daunting college text book, which is exactly why I bought and read it; it looked like I might finally get something truthful, which I did.

    But the copy I bought my sister is left unread because it looks a lot of effort to read. She says, "well I can just ask you"- which obviously isn't going to work.

    Sure, I can tell her the LP programming, tell her to hit proper depth etc, but there isn't a single sentence wasted in the book- every page is useful and to get the why's instead of just the what's, it needs to be read. And its the why's which are the most important as it (sometimes) stops one from falling back into doing stupid stuff. (I say sometimes, because obviously you know from other posts I've messed up).

    She did really well following the LP programming. Then ended up with a lengthy layoff for whatever reason, then decided to get back into lifting wights. What did she do? Sets of 10s with light weights so she could "ease back up to the weights previously handled". I got her to reason that if the original programme worked well the first time, and she was now de-trained, surely it makes more sense to do that programme again- but if she has just read the book, she wouldn't have wasted time on her own programme.

    I recognise I sound like a hypocrite here, but she's supposed to be the clever one yet seems so put off by the book.

    My mother's copy of barbell prescription is depressingly left unread and its pointless even bother to try getting my dad to read any of the books because he knows absolutely everything already. At least my girlfriend gets it- I'm looking forward to seeing how she does at the RN champs.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by tallison View Post
    OK, apologies for questioning your sincerity -- I plead "the Internet" .
    Out of curiosity what do you make of the stuff Stan Efferding has to say about Starting Strength at the 1:38:18 mark in this video:https://youtu.be/Ky7DgrDJB8s

    Stan may not have the reach of Michael Jordan, but is this the sort of thing you have in mind?

    I don't know that Stan would be the best spokesperson for SS. I think he gained most of his strength using "other" methods than SS. I think its cool that he endorsed SS. I hope that he helps spread the word to some of his more well known friends and his many followers.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theseahawk View Post
    Its because it looks like a daunting college text book, which is exactly why I bought and read it; it looked like I might finally get something truthful, which I did.

    But the copy I bought my sister is left unread because it looks a lot of effort to read. She says, "well I can just ask you"- which obviously isn't going to work.

    Sure, I can tell her the LP programming, tell her to hit proper depth etc, but there isn't a single sentence wasted in the book- every page is useful and to get the why's instead of just the what's, it needs to be read. And its the why's which are the most important as it (sometimes) stops one from falling back into doing stupid stuff. (I say sometimes, because obviously you know from other posts I've messed up).

    She did really well following the LP programming. Then ended up with a lengthy layoff for whatever reason, then decided to get back into lifting wights. What did she do? Sets of 10s with light weights so she could "ease back up to the weights previously handled". I got her to reason that if the original programme worked well the first time, and she was now de-trained, surely it makes more sense to do that programme again- but if she has just read the book, she wouldn't have wasted time on her own programme.

    I recognise I sound like a hypocrite here, but she's supposed to be the clever one yet seems so put off by the book.

    My mother's copy of barbell prescription is depressingly left unread and its pointless even bother to try getting my dad to read any of the books because he knows absolutely everything already. At least my girlfriend gets it- I'm looking forward to seeing how she does at the RN champs.
    As I have said many times, folks, we are narrowcasting. This shit does not appeal to everybody, it is not accessible to everybody, and it is not understandable to everybody. It is perfectly logical to us, and we understand the importance of it, but most people cannot fathom the fact that a simple progressive increase in the loading of 5 simple structural exercises can accumulate into the biggest improvement in their lives they can make.

    But really, they just don't want to do the work.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    But really, they just don't want to do the work.
    This. The majority that "workout" or "lift" will never understand that to make progress, the "work" part of "workout" has to stay in the equation. Work that is worthwhile is difficult and uncomfortable and lots of people can't stand being uncomfortable.

    Throwing a book to these people only makes it worse, like they might actually have to read it or something...

  5. #25
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    It is perfectly logical to us, and we understand the importance of it, but most people cannot fathom the fact that a simple progressive increase in the loading of 5 simple structural exercises can accumulate into the biggest improvement in their lives they can make.
    It is frustrating to see loved ones and lifting bros and gals alike struggle to make progress. SS always seems to be on the back burner while what ever p-90x , RPPE or functional strength fad crap gets all kinds of recognition.

    I get niche markets and SS is not for everyone. It can just get very frustrating that a good program like SS does not get more focus from the general public

  6. #26
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    Jul 2019
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zappey1 View Post
    As far as this part I would think like a Michel Jordan for SS. Is the average person doing SS going to reach this pinnacle? No but it could still be a good marketing tool just like MJ for Nike. Because I'm wearing Nike shoes am I going to play basketball as good as MJ? No way but I still like to know his (MJ) statistics even if I'm never going to reach them. Same idea with the top lifters from SS.
    The lack of that kind of disingenuous marketing was what drew me to Starting Strength. I wasn't attracted by "look at this, this person's the best ever and we trained them". What got me was "we have taken regular people weaker than you and made them stronger than you are now".

  7. #27
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    Apr 2018
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zappey1 View Post
    Imaging if they had a jacked SS coach squatting 600 lbs with perfect form with SS boots and belt on. Might get more people interested in getting the SS products? Especially if you could go to their FB and YouTube and see them training people with the SS model.
    See, here is a problem: You are posting on the same board as we are and have the same information, and it’s colored your perception of what people want more than you realize. I hate to say this, but basically nobody cares how much you can squat. If you showed them the video you describe, they’d wonder why you’re showing them a some old guy wearing weird boots and a weird belt doing this really slow and painful-looking movement. This kind of issue comes up in a lot of discussions I see online: Who would want to go to a Starting Strength gym when there’s a cheaper facility with ten times as much equipment in a warehouse a few minutes down the highway? Well, not everyone is as excited by Rogue equipment, young bros doing heavy benches and rows, and loud music as the people making those posts are.

    As for what would work better, your guess is as good as mine. I’ve got the same biases as you and would find a smart guy wearing superior equipment doing a heavy lift to be a compelling case. Frankly, look at the people already here: smart, strong, witty, good-looking, compassionate people with interesting life stories. You can’t ask for a much better face for SS than that. I’m at a loss for how it doesn’t catch with the general public, but that just shows how much of a bubble we’re in.

  8. #28
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    May 2017
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    Most people I know aren’t following anyone online at all for guidance. They get their information passed on from someone they see as knowledgeable because that person performs in a way or looks the way they want to be able to too.

    So the “it’s all you” benching continues (me and my first training partner in 2005 were definitely guilty of this), the half squatting, and hitting the biceps from 6 different angle continues on and on.

    I’ve managed to have a small amount of influence amongst my workmates recently. A couple of them have got the bug when we away from our routine lives in the U.K. and I got them in the gym at Eglin AFB. We got 4 sessions in during the two weeks and that was just enough for them to see the proof in the pudding.

    One lad didn’t join us and said he was happy doing his own thing. But we’ve started putting our progression up on the whiteboard in the office back home and this week I learned he had started training training the same way after seeing the progression of the other two and was excited how his number “just keep going up”.

    He still had an ab and arm day this week though. I scoffed at it and he said “his abs are sore so it must be working and he wanted to let his legs recover properly as they had felt weak”. Tried telling him that his feeling of soreness or weakness don’t indicate anything about effectiveness or ability to lift more than last time. Maybe I can get my sisters book back and leave it in the office.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Y View Post
    I hate to say this, but basically nobody cares how much you can squat. If you showed them the video you describe, they’d wonder why you’re showing them a some old guy wearing weird boots and a weird belt doing this really slow and painful-looking movement.
    Some people do care. I notice that I get more people asking me for advice in the gym when I am lifting heavier weights.


    The thing that initially convinced me to get on board with Starting Strength was, by chance, coming across a 15-20 year old video of Rip coaching on youtube (Not SS branded or created); his competence teaching the lifts, in addition to his ability to simply and logically explain why he was teaching the lifts a certain way was what convinced me to get the book.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yngvi View Post
    Some people do care. I notice that I get more people asking me for advice in the gym when I am lifting heavier weights.
    And this was the original idea behind this question and discussion. Do numbers matter? Like it or not but to a certain extent they do. You don't want (or at least I and everyone I know who trains)a scrawny Nerdlinger trying to teach you how to squat 500 lbs no matter how good of a coach they are.

    If SS coaches have above average lifts (which they do or did in 2016) then that could be a great marketing tool.

    To take it a step further highlight some of the coaching and lifting of the strongest coaches (male and female multiple weight classes). This could attract new believers and give some of us long time fans something to strive for.

    These are all just ideas. Nothing to get worked up and defensive about. I never thought so many people would have such strong feelings about this.

    Some people like their coffee black others like cream and sugar in it but at the end of the day we all enjoy SS brand coffee and want to see it thrive and grow.

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