COVID19 Factors We Should Consider/Current Events

[Yngvi]

And do they not then have to duck collections agencies for the rest of their lives? I’m not judging either way, I just hate arguing with people and being wrong.

The collections agencies do not come after you when:
-You gave a fake SS# for billing or do not have one because you are an illegal alien
-You do not have a permanent, long-term address or have given a fake address
-You did not speak English or your speech was too incomprehensible to understand, thus preventing them from obtaining billing information
-You are too poor for the collections agencies to reasonably expect they will get more money from you than they spent trying to collect the money from you.

The people ducking collections agencies are middle class.

[David A. Rowe]

Cops RUSH Active Shooter - YouTube

I think this video does a better job than I could of relaying what I would safely assume is a majority opinion among law enforcement. We actually studied this incident and others during our CQB and Active Shooter training. The commentary is on point

My key takeaways (generalized):
-Patrol Division will almost always be first on scene, and patrol officers and deputies are not equipped to the level of SRT/SWAT. This has very meaningful impacts on tactics.

-The odds that even one responding officer has intimate knowledge of even part of the facility is very, very low. You are likely going in completely cold for building layout and the presence of subjects on site.

[Brian Harlin]

-The odds that even one responding officer has intimate knowledge of even part of the facility is very, very low. You are likely going in completely cold for building layout and the presence of subjects on site.

That’s a great video, thanks for sharing. I think in the case of Uvalde though, the odds of some officers knowing the building layout of an elementary school (maybe the only one) in a rural town are pretty good.

[johnst_nhb]

Cops RUSH Active Shooter - YouTube

I think this video does a better job than I could of relaying what I would safely assume is a majority opinion among law enforcement. We actually studied this incident and others during our CQB and Active Shooter training. The commentary is on point

My key takeaways (generalized):
-Patrol Division will almost always be first on scene, and patrol officers and deputies are not equipped to the level of SRT/SWAT. This has very meaningful impacts on tactics.

-The odds that even one responding officer has intimate knowledge of even part of the facility is very, very low. You are likely going in completely cold for building layout and the presence of subjects on site.

This makes sense. And it’s logical.

I’ve zero experience with this. I did find it interesting that the responding dept (from what I have seen, if legit info) had training on this exact scenario shortly prior to this incident and the training appears to be explicit about how they should act immediately. If true, it was the opposite of what was done. Hard to know what’s the truth, but it’s coming out that the entire office (field officers) had this training.

I don’t know man, I just feel like- speaking for me only- I’d have a hard time standing down when I could hear shots continuing inside a school. Especially with parents outside willing to go in themselves. I understand cops keeping parents from fucking things up IF they were actively in the building to waste the shooter, but by all accounts they weren’t. That is heartbreaking and fucked up.

They did themselves no favors by arresting (literal sense, not legal) parents trying to run in. People say the mother who went in had incredible courage but I don’t think so. I suspect courage had nothing to with it. I believe it was so instinctual for her to help her children that there was no option. This opinion assumes a definition of courage is being scared it doing it anyway.

Mike Monsoor dove on a grenade one day on a rooftop in Iraq to save his teammates. I doubt he thought “there’s a live grenade, I’m scared but I guess I’ll do this to help my friends”. I’ve often pondered his story as well as many others’ who have done these incredible selfless things. It happens in an instant. Something in them was instinctual. And they weren’t his kids.

Would anyone on this board with kids not die trying to protect them? Sincere question: if you had the chance but didn’t take it, would you just sit back and watch football next weekend?

I obviously know the answer to this question.

That said everyone has a plan until they are punched in the mouth. I am aware of that truth.

But live for nothing or die for something.

This being said, I ain’t runnin’ in no crack house if I hear gunshots.

Sorry for the diary post, this whole thing is so heartbreaking and bothers me a bit more than I expected. Perhaps it’s in part the deterioration of my regard for the police as an organization (note: not all individual cops).

I’ve got opinions on solving this- it involves more guns on school property not less. But teachers are so unstable, it’s not them who should be armed.

[Sean Berry]

That’s a great video, thanks for sharing. I think in the case of Uvalde though, the odds of some officers knowing the building layout of an elementary school (maybe the only one) in a rural town are pretty good.

You have no idea what you are talking about. 6 public elementary schools, and a couple of private. 30K population if undocumented (illegals) are included in the mass of humanity that is Uvalde. No, it is not a metropolis, but also not a quaint rural south Texas town.

I’ve got opinions on solving this- it involves more guns on school property not less. But teachers are so unstable, it’s not them who should be armed.

1) Fuck you. Pretty broad brush you are painting with there.

2) Those educators that are armed in class rooms undergo training and mental evaluation before being allowed to carry on campus. This is ongoing and not just a 1 time thing. Non-renewal of training means loss of carrying.

I am genuinely curious about who should be packing on campus, in your opinion, if not the unstable teachers.

[anticausal]

-Patrol Division will almost always be first on scene, and patrol officers and deputies are not equipped to the level of SRT/SWAT. This has very meaningful impacts on tactics.

-The odds that even one responding officer has intimate knowledge of even part of the facility is very, very low. You are likely going in completely cold for building layout and the presence of subjects on site.

1) Maybe we shouldn't have SWAT. Why do we have militarized police units? None of this nonsense existed until the 60s, when Americans were coincidentally stripped of national sovereignty and became a global police unit and economic migration zone.

Americans are supposed to just-figure-it-out. That's what we're supposed to be good at, not sitting around waiting on the cavalry. I mean, the guy who stopped this thing got a gun from his barber for fucks sake. That guy and his barber are worth more than every SWAT team in post-America. SWAT was sold to us for exactly these situations (we were fools to buy it), when in reality their number one function is no-kock raiding (accidentally spelled "no-knock" wrong, but I think I'll keep it).

2) Maybe the odds would be higher if the community policed it's own. I wonder what the average commute is for American police. Instead of holding parents back and treating them like a threat, they should be working with them to fix the situation. This "us/them" liability thinking from the bureaucrats with guns has become an absolute disaster.

It won't be fixed, of course, and neither will the US government. But when we rebuild from the ashes, let's make sure we get this shit right next time.

[Barry Charles]

I’ve recently come across several opinion pieces that state the climate crisis is due to fossil fuel, not population growth.

It occurs to me that, by analogy, the homicide crisis is blamed on guns, not homicide.

While these are my distilled interpretations of the arguments, is this a simple division of the the “left” blaming the inanimate over the person and the “ right” holding the individual accountable?

Could it be that simple?

[Brian Harlin]

You have no idea what you are talking about. 6 public elementary schools, and a couple of private. 30K population if undocumented (illegals) are included in the mass of humanity that is Uvalde. No, it is not a metropolis, but also not a quaint rural south Texas town.

I said maybe the only one, not definitely the only one. Often public schools share the same architectural designs based on the period in which they are built. So if there are 6 public schools there may be only 2 or 3 building layouts. It’s also likely that local police officers have children that are currently attending or have attended these schools.

[anticausal]

You have no idea what you are talking about. 6 public elementary schools, and a couple of private. 30K population if undocumented (illegals) are included in the mass of humanity that is Uvalde. No, it is not a metropolis, but also not a quaint rural south Texas town. .

Isn't that the point of precincts? I have no idea how routes and patrols are organized, but focusing on having cops become intimate with a local area seems like a no-brainer. If cops are patrolling areas that cover 6 different elementary schools, I think something is wrong. The chances that a first responder knows the public buildings in his area well should be high, not low. This should be doable even in NYC, if you partition things appropriately.

[Mark Rippetoe]

I’ve recently come across several opinion pieces that state the climate crisis is due to fossil fuel, not population growth.

It occurs to me that, by analogy, the homicide crisis is blamed on guns, not homicide.

While these are my distilled interpretations of the arguments, is this a simple division of the the “left” blaming the inanimate over the person and the “ right” holding the individual accountable?

Could it be that simple?

Inanimate objects are easier to control than people who don't want to be controlled, so you're probably right. Inanimate objects can be banned, seized, prohibited, tariffed, taxed, buy-backed, melted down, not manufactured, not produced, not grown, not sold, not transported, burned, made unfashionable, and buried. Assholes are harder to deal with.