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Thread: A missing piece in the program?

  1. #11
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    So squats make your hip flexion ability stronger, make sense. but is it optimal to train for stronger hip flexor musculature without concentrically loading them? The same way you wouldn't make someone only bench press if they want a strong back. Yes the back gets stronger from benching, but it's not the optimal way to make it strong. wouldn't you agree?

  2. #12
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    I agree with OP. I know this wont be popular but it always seemed to me like a missing part of the program was the cross body-rear delt flexion action that occurs naturally whenever one moves to scratch their balls, then sniffs their fingers. Its a natural human movement I do dozens of times every day and the program fails to strengthen this movement, putting me at risk for shoulder impingement, pectoral tears and jock itch.

    Fix this.

  3. #13
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    Good answer, dumb question confirmed. Thanks.

  4. #14
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    Hip flexion is an important aspect of running, jumping and kicking. All important for various sports. Open your mind to a new idea

  5. #15
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    Okay.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    The hip flexors are the rectus femoris of the quadriceps, the sartorius, and maybe the tensor fasciae latae and the psoas -- not much muscle mass, because it's not a human movement pattern that is under a load very often. Look at the anatomy and tell me how much of that muscle is engaged eccentrically during the flexion/eccentric phase of the squat.
    Probably not a common movement pattern for any species and that's why the psoas/tenderloin is, well.... tender on the steer, hog, elk or deer.

  7. #17
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    How often are those movements LOADED (I'm going to define that as weight is added to the human body) in normal human movement is the main concern. It's difficult and not common to load weight on your leg and kick, run or jump. Yes yes yes there are I'm sure some people that throw on ruck packs, weighed vests and such. But in normal everyday human activity and movement I can't think of any time where running, jumping and kicking are LOADED movements.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle Stevens View Post
    How often are those movements LOADED (I'm going to define that as weight is added to the human body) in normal human movement is the main concern. It's difficult and not common to load weight on your leg and kick, run or jump. Yes yes yes there are I'm sure some people that throw on ruck packs, weighed vests and such. But in normal everyday human activity and movement I can't think of any time where running, jumping and kicking are LOADED movements.
    This is my thought as well. I don't see how any of these movements could be loaded beyond 100 lbs or so.

    Maybe there's a case for using them as assistance exercise, but pushing the main lifts up in weight is probably more effective and a better use of resources.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by yamshiloh View Post
    Hip flexion is an important aspect of running, jumping and kicking. All important for various sports. Open your mind to a new idea
    When kicking, hip flexion is usually used to "charge" the leg so that an extension movement will transmit the force to your target. With a snap kick the hip is flexed so that the knee can be rapidly extended with the foot in extension. With a front kick the hip is flexed to raise the leg, but then extended as the knee is extended with the foot flexed. The stomp kick is similar, but with far more hip extension. The side kick flexes the hip to position and "charge" but then both hips are extended (when properly executed). An axe kick and crescent kick use a lot of hip flexion, but again it is the hip extension that does the damage.
    I suppose a case could be made for the roundhouse kick, but that involves simultaneous extension of one hip and flexion of the other as well as knee and foot extension.

    Hip flexion is certainly important, but I don't see how it is SO important that it must be specially trained for strength. I did, however, just think of some equipment that could be used to train it. I should probably patent it and start drawing up service contacts.

  10. #20
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    starting strength coach development program
    This question made the podcast. This Friday.

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