Muscle mass effects on testosterone

[Carlsongee]

Hello,

I was wondering if you know if muscle mass will result in healthy hormone levels as we age.

I couldn't find research on the relationship between testosterone levels and muscle mass, just exercises induced testosterone response which isn't what i'm looking for.

I know that fat can cause excess estrogen somehow, and also that testosterone can build muscle... But does muscle have any effect on hormones?

The exercise effect on testosterone is minimal and is probably a side effect of cortisol secretion, and has probably little effect on protein synthesis. But over time, as we get stronger and build more muscle, will this result in an improved hormone profile directly through muscle mass or nervous fibres, or perhaps any secondary effects from increased metabolism?

[Mark Rippetoe]

I know of no evidence that muscle mass secretes or causes the secretion of testosterone. Not even Exercise Physiologists have suggested such a thing.

[FatButWeak]

I'll stick my dick into this hornet's nest and suggest that muscle mass probably performs an endocrine function of some sort. Perhaps not as a "secreter" or producer of testosterone, but as a signaller that indicates a need for continued production of testosterone to maintain/build muscle tissue. Working the muscle causes the muscle (along with other organs/systems) to signal the endocrine system to ramp up/maintain production.

Do I have "proof" of this? Sort of. It seems to be how feedback loops in most bodily systems. One organ/tissue creates a need or demand which is transmitted to the organs of production, either through another hormone or a neurological signal. So I would totally expect MORE muscle mass to make a louder/larger demand. However, proper training (load, volume, frequency, movemenet patenr, etc.) is probably the finger that causes the muscle mass switch.

[Mark Rippetoe]

Then why do huge bodybuilders take testosterone?

[Steven Kalin]

Then why do huge bodybuilders take testosterone?

Just spitballing, but maybe because they are looking for faster, bigger gains than the human body could ever naturally produce without a 150 year lifespan?

[Carlsongee]

Then why do huge bodybuilders take testosterone?

Do you know of any of your trainees improving their testosterone levels after running linear progression for 3-6 months, or taking their squat from 60 kg to 140 kg for reps in 6 months and building a stack of muscle on their legs?

This could possibly prove that muscle has an influence on the total level of testosterone. Also it could be in an discrete way, such as raised free testosterone, rather than total serum.

[Mark Rippetoe]

Just spitballing, but maybe because they are looking for faster, bigger gains than the human body could ever naturally produce without a 150 year lifespan?

A 150-year lifespan?

Do you know of any of your trainees improving their testosterone levels after running linear progression for 3-6 months, or taking their squat from 60 kg to 140 kg for reps in 6 months and building a stack of muscle on their legs?

No, I don't know of any.

[Carlsongee]

No, I don't know of any.[/QUOTE]

I found a few articles that investigated serum and basal t after 13 weeks of resistance training and found it to be unaltered. Also some concluded that androgen receptors were more important for the muscle building response, as high test levels didn't correspond to highest muscle building response to training.

Can't find much understandable information on androgen receptors, but I wonder if increases in muscle mass (sarcoplasmic of myofibilar) effects them some how.
It probably wont impact their sensitivity or density, though perhaps more over all, which could maintain healthy test levels, due to increased requirements, similar to what the poster above suggested.

[FatButWeak]

Then why do huge bodybuilders take testosterone?

Same reason they take insulin - to unnaturally force an unnatural amount of unnatural growth.

I'm pretty sure most people who take high enough doses of AAS to become huge bodybuilders permanently compromise their body's ability to make testosterone in abundance. So looking to that damaged population for evidence probably doesn't work.

Perhaps that part of the phenomenon behind "muscle memory" - the nuclei signal more test for growth/strength increases.

[Steven Kalin]

A 150-year lifespan?

Ok, ignore that part.

I’m hardly as knowledgeable about the science of testosterone as you, Rip, but I’m pretty sure most bodybuilders don’t start taking test to combat low test. I’ve known a few. I’m also curious about the original question.

The Best Exercises To Increase Testosterone | Piedmont Healthcare