Is 2023 a Big Year for Testosterone?

[Smyth]

I came across this via Instapundit, and have to admit I don’t understand what the implications might be with respect to TRT or HRT. Might Dr. Nichols and Dr. Wittmer be invited to weigh in? And, I would guess Rip understands this better than I do. Thoughts? 2023 Could Be Big For Testosterone: AbbVie And ANI Best Positioned (ABBV) (ANIP) | Seeking Alpha

[Mark Rippetoe]

I was posting this when I saw your post. At least it's being discussed in places other than here.

A unblinded review with 4,000 patient years of data, showed that TRT in post-menopausal women, who were at risk of experiencing CV events, reduced the number of CV events by at least 70% over expectations. It also reduced the number of CV events by an undisclosed amount over placebo. In 2015, they discovered that TRT reduced breast cancer events by an undisclosed amount over expectations. A finding not evident during the earlier review or when the trial was completed (December 2012). The discoveries are only public in patent applications, listing the Study Director, Dr. Michael C. Snabes (Senior Medical Director with AbbVie Global Clinical Research and Development) as one of the inventors.

[Smyth]

Agreed. It seems past “studies” were almost designed to find that testosterone was harmful or at least of no help. I hope the two Docs can enlighten us.

[Mark Rippetoe]

Agreed. It seems past “studies” were almost designed to find that testosterone was harmful or at least of no help. I hope the two Docs can enlighten us.

They already have.

[Smyth]

With respect to the studies talked about in the link? I missed that.

[Mark Rippetoe]

The studies in the link are irrelevant, since they didn't tell our docs anything they didn't already know from other studies and personal experience with the phenomenology. The studies in the link are just catching up. I'm happy they are, but they don't really change anything.

[Smyth]

The studies in the link are irrelevant, since they didn't tell our docs anything they didn't already know from other studies and personal experience with the phenomenology. The studies in the link are just catching up. I'm happy they are, but they don't really change anything.

Oh, I misread it then. I thought the piece said some of these large studies will be concluding, and results released, this year. My bad.

[dalan]

Maybe in 20 years the medical community will catch up to where we (on this forum) are now concerning TRT. But I doubt it.

[J. Keith Nichols MD]

I came across this via Instapundit, and have to admit I don’t understand what the implications might be with respect to TRT or HRT. Might Dr. Nichols and Dr. Wittmer be invited to weigh in? And, I would guess Rip understands this better than I do. Thoughts? 2023 Could Be Big For Testosterone: AbbVie And ANI Best Positioned (ABBV) (ANIP) | Seeking Alpha

The Traverse Trial. I bet we can all predict what the results are going to be before the results even come in. Of course they're using a low-dose of testosterone in the form of Androgel. So we can predict that Androgel is not going to cause any harm with regard to major adverse cardiac events. But you're also going to see, more likely than not, that it doesn't make anybody feel any better. So we're going to once again raise testosterone levels just a little bit and expect excellent clinical results. It doesn't happen when you only raise testosterone a little bit with Androgel. The trial is also in men with testosterone levels less than 300. Wouldn't it be great to see a trial in men with so-called normal levels that are symptomatic and then comparing the results when they are treated with a placebo, a low-dose testosterone like Androgel, and then an adequate dose of testosterone to raise their levels to the so-called supra-physiologic range? As I have discussed in previous podcasts with Rip, there are numerous studies using testosterone in men that failed to show any benefit, and they common denominator is that they only used a little bit of testosterone, therefore they only raise levels a little bit. Testosterone has also been used since 1935, it has been used in thousands of randomized controlled trials, and it has never been shown to cause harm any of those studies. So we're not going to see anything new with this new study, but at least hopefully it will show and prove what we already know, that testosterone is safe. I'm sure the critics will argue even though it's safe it doesn't work so men don't need it.

[Buffaloguy]

I started Test Cyp 5 weeks ago so I'm doing my part.