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Thread: Forbidden discussion: Childhood vaccinations

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Subby View Post
    Does DDT usage and polio correlate in other countries or just the US? I'm not 100% sure that it does, it follows the similar trend of Autism and MMR, it's a US only phenomenon.
    The first major suspected outbreaks of polio didn't occur until the early 1900s, well after the introduction of neurotoxic insecticides/chemicals.
    Worldwide peaks of polio coincided with global usage of DDT; I am not aware of any large scale use of DDT internationally following the World Health Organization DDT program in 1955.

    This is not at all the same as the Autism-MMR argument:
    1. Autism-MMR is the converse of the Polio-paralysis argument; Autism-MMR is correlation, as is the Polio virus-polio disease (never isolated and never directly shown to cause the disease), whereas DDT can be directly shown to cause paralysis and Polio-disease like symptoms in a dose-dependent manner every time.
    2.Autism-MMR is not a falsifiable hypothesis; DDT-Polio Disease is a falsifiable hypothesis.

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    Autism-MMR was simply research fraud, blatant conflict of interest by the primary researcher and irresponsible publication by Lancet. Not to mention the piss poor "study" with a sample size of 12!

    Good luck Ray

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    It's worth considering (and asking your pediatrician) that it was only in 2015 that they discovered the lymph system is connected to the brain.

    “We think these vessels may play a role in pathogenesis of neurological conditions that have an immune component,”
    So with vaccines you're injecting a chemical into your blood that modulates your immune system, which is plumbed directly into the brain - which nobody knew until about 7 years ago. How does this change the messaging over the years that vaccines couldn't possibly play a role in any neurological issues that kids develop? I have never heard any doctor or other 'expert' address this directly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lost and Found View Post
    Autism-MMR was simply research fraud, blatant conflict of interest by the primary researcher and irresponsible publication by Lancet. Not to mention the piss poor "study" with a sample size of 12!

    Good luck Ray
    I'd go back and look at the history of the case. Wakefield wasn't researching the link between the two.

    And if it was simply wrong, why go after his and his colleagues licenses? When else has that happened?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan DCNT View Post
    Jesus, that's how many vaccines kids are getting these days? When I was a kid I think we were only supposed to get like 3 or 4, then again I if I was a baby I wouldn't remember anyway. But that seems like a shit ton of vaccines.
    The schedule mysteriously exploded after a liability shield was created.

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    Quote Originally Posted by francesco.decaro View Post
    Hey Ray, I don't know if this could be helpful but I'm reading this book called Dissolving Illusions
    The part of that book on Polio has been quite controversial, to say the least.
    Some critical remarks on it are collected here: Wrong About Polio: A Review of Suzanne Humphries, MD and Roman Bystrianyk’s “Dissolving Illusions” Part 1 (the long version) | Science-Based Medicine

    This is just for completeness, not to take either side.


    Quote Originally Posted by Lost and Found View Post
    Autism-MMR was simply research fraud, blatant conflict of interest by the primary researcher and irresponsible publication by Lancet. Not to mention the piss poor "study" with a sample size of 12!
    One interesting face of that story is that the article was co-signed by Wakefield and another doctor, Prof. John Walker-Smith. They both got struck off the UK medical register, but Walker-Smith took the Medical Council to court about the decision and won:

    MMR doctor wins High Court appeal - BBC News

    The sentence in that case makes quite an interesting reading, albeit a bit dry: Walker-Smith v General Medical Council [2012] EWHC 503 (Admin) (07 March 2012)

    To sum it up, imho the way media has portrayed that famous research paper was full of approximations, and failed to capture a lot of important details. And this has inescapably tarnished the debate about it.

    On the other hand, as far as I know, Wakefield never convincingly explained why he didn't appeal too.


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  7. #17
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    I appreciate you guys taking the time to respond to this. I suppose your answers illuminate why the government sticks with a simple, black and white narrative on this stuff. The trouble is it creates significant distrust.

    Quote Originally Posted by HailMary View Post
    I'd consider changing risk of polio exposure to low, not no.
    Based on the number of cases in the US in the last 40 years and where those cases took place, I believe the statistical probability of exposure is low enough here in Idaho to refer to it as no risk. That doesn't mean the risk won't increase in the future - and if it does, I will reconsider.

    Quote Originally Posted by HailMary View Post
    I'd consider that you will hit a "give us your vaccination records" barrier to entry somewhere along the line, depending on what institution you are wanting to join, where you live and what exemptions are allowed.
    I agree, this will likely be a problem. We plan on home schooling which should address most of it.

    Quote Originally Posted by HailMary View Post
    I'd consider whether my MD might fire us and if so, would there be viable alternatives in the area where I live?
    Luckily there's a doctor out here, whom we're seeing for the first time tomorrow, that asks if you want vaccines and asks no follow up questions if you say no.

    Quote Originally Posted by HailMary View Post
    Lastly, I always find it helpful to ask myself if I'm wrong, and if so, what parts might be wrong. Can I move forward on a decision not being certain? Is my decision being unduly influenced by group-think or what I prefer to be true? What would it look like if down the line if I came to regret the decision? What would it look like if my daughter did not agree with my decision, and she suffered for it. Good luck sorting it all out and congrats on your daughter.
    This is the real concern and the reason for the post. Quite a fucking mess to sort through! And thank you for the congratulations. Lily has brought overwhelming love into our lives.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholas Laureys View Post
    Go to a few interviews with pediatrician's offices (which I assume you have done / already plan to do anyway) and feign hesitancy to ALL of the vaccines to see how the doctors react. Tell them you've done a bit of research and want to be convinced why ALL of them should, in fact, be administered, vs. picking & choosing a la carte, or even refusing them all.
    I had a conversation with two MDs, one a pediatrician, about this over lunch a few weeks back. One said "I'm not an epidemiologist. I trust that there are smarter people than me at the CDC." To which I replied, "Blind faith is dangerous, isn't it?" They both looked at me like I claimed the earth was flat.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yngvi View Post
    Because Ray doesn't have enough to think about already; the DDT-Polio connection:
    Reddit - Dive into anything

    More recent outbreaks of polio are the exact same strain as the vaccines; the outbreaks were likely caused by the vaccine itself.
    Zerohedge
    It's the real-world efficacy and unintended consequences that really concern me here. It occurs to me that if the CDC were fully invested in public health as their #1 priority, there would be constant testing (short term and long term) and regular reporting on up to date vaccine safety and efficacy. They showed their true colors during C19.

    Quote Originally Posted by Subby View Post
    Does DDT usage and polio correlate in other countries or just the US? I'm not 100% sure that it does, it follows the similar trend of Autism and MMR, it's a US only phenomenon.
    I'd like to know this too. I'm not aware of a great resource online that sticks to reporting the data and leaves the analysis up to us.

    Quote Originally Posted by my_back_hurts View Post
    So with vaccines you're injecting a chemical into your blood that modulates your immune system, which is plumbed directly into the brain - which nobody knew until about 7 years ago.
    Especially considering the potential link between aluminum and neuro-degeneration. This is one of my main concerns. I'm not aware of any long term testing to prove one way or the other, but we know that it's a toxic substance and intramuscular injections put this shit directly into the bloodstream - up to a full mg if the standard schedule is followed.



    Keep it coming if you have anything else to share. Especially unadulterated numbers, which curiously seem to be hard to come by.

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    My cousin’s kid is autistic. She’s a pharmacist, so not exactly a conspiracy theorist or whatever the moniker is nowadays. She’s fairly certain that the autism developed when she brought the kid to the emergency room with a high fever and they gave him the BCG vaccine without her consent. She refuses to vaccinate further.

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    Ray, I’d keep on eye on the wastewater testing being implemented in some communities. There is growing public health interest in seeing how widespread polio is in the USA.

    CDC planning wastewater testing for polio in select communities | CDC Online Newsroom | CDC

    OPV (not recommended in the USA any longer. USA = IPV only since 2000) is used in other parts of the world and polio virus is shed thru waste from OPV which puts unvaccinated people at risk. People immigrate here to work. People travel to this country on vacation. The risk could be very very low, but maybe keep an eye on the situation?

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    As I indicated in my previous post; yes the international incidence rate roughly coincides with DDT/neurotoxic pesticide/chemical usage.

    If you have searched, you likely saw that international reports of case numbers begin abruptly the same year the WHO introduced its global vaccination campaign.
    However, we also run into the problem with polio that it is impossible to accurately diagnose the disease or keep track of case numbers, even in first world countries.
    The numbers don't mean much.

    Non-polio acute flaccid paralysis (exact same symptoms as polio) has coincidentally risen to over 100,000 cases per year internationally, while polio cases have dropped.
    In two of the three countries where polio is considered endemic, they have very high non-polio acute flaccid paralysis rates.

    And, let's remember the wastewater polio testing etc in the 2020s is a pcr test.
    We should all know and recognize the problems with pcr testing after Covid.

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