eating more when stuck, while already eating enaough?

[Samuelsson]

Hi,

I’ve read the ‘eating through the sticking points’ article and attached forum posts, but I’m obviously stupid because I still can’t wrap my head around why exactly eating more helps breaking through barriers ASSUMING one already eats (more than) enough to cover the needed energy to repair and grow more muscle mass. (I’m talking about guys who eat 4000, 5000 or more… calories a day)

I can’t imagine upping the food intake will magically create even more muscle than is required/dictated by the intensity of the training (again, assuming one already eats enough to allow for repair and growth of muscle mass)? I’d guess eating even more food would just be transformed to more fat?

I have, however, also read that ALL fat increase is accompanied by SOME muscle increase (and vice versa that ALL fat loss goes hand in hand with SOME muscle loss, except when using chemicals)…

So is this all there is to it, or what is it that I don’t get?

PS 1: I’m not asking this because of myself or personal situation, but just an honest question in general.
PS 2: I’m also not criticising anything, anyone or any line of thought.

[Jordan Feigenbaum]

How tall are you, what do you weigh, what is your age, and what are you squatting right now for a set a 5?

In the context of actually doing SSLP (<2% of all comers) and being underweight while NOT GAINING WEIGHT FAST ENOUGH, eating more will certainly help.

[Samuelsson]

Thanks for your reply Jordan, but this really isn't a question about myself (I anticipated this, hence the 2 remarks at the end of my post).

Anyway I'm just genuinely wondering what the reasoning behind this is, I'm neither questioning or denying the observed fact of 'eating through sticking points', I just didn't find a (to me) satisfying explanation as to why...?

Thanks

[Jordan Feigenbaum]

Thanks for your reply Jordan, but this really isn't a question about myself (I anticipated this, hence the 2 remarks at the end of my post).

Anyway I'm just genuinely wondering what the reasoning behind this is, I'm neither questioning or denying the observed fact of 'eating through sticking points', I just didn't find a (to me) satisfying explanation as to why...?

Thanks

You're asking why gaining weight in some contexts produces sustained strength acquisition?

[Mister_DMC]

I think what he's asking Jordan is pertaining to that specific article. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that article is aimed at advanced lifters that are competitive powerlifters trying to eek out every last bit of strength increase.

At least that's what it sounded like when I read it, while I found it entertaining I don't think eating a 11×13 sheet cake everyday is for everyone.

[Arlene Dukes]

Wow. I wish I could eat more like that. Ever since I was diagnosed with depression, my food intake started to decline. I love foods and eating was my hobby before. Haha. But, now, I barely touch the food.

[Samuelsson]

OK, I’m clearly not formulating my question clearly or I’m missing the point somewhere. 

So I’ll try again using this oversimplified example: assume an experienced lifter (not me!) is hitting a plateau or getting stuck, while he is already eating enough to allow for repair and muscle growth (because we assume he’s experienced and knows how to eat to grow, because that’s how he got to be this good in the first place. I’m talking about the type of lifters mentioned in the article about eating through the sticking point, not underweight people or people who think they eat enough but actually don’t.)

These people can overcome their ‘sticking point’ by eating a lot more.

So as I see it, this could mean
A) they actually didn’t yet eat enough, hence getting stronger by eating even more, or
B) there must be something else to explain this, because we assume they already eat enough, and an even bigger food intake would just lead to more fat (with perhaps just a little bit of extra muscle accompanying it?)
C) I’m plain stupid, and it’s something else, already mentioned elsewhere…

Please enlighten me 

[Jordan Feigenbaum]

I think what he's asking Jordan is pertaining to that specific article. Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that article is aimed at advanced lifters that are competitive powerlifters trying to eek out every last bit of strength increase.

At least that's what it sounded like when I read it, while I found it entertaining I don't think eating a 11×13 sheet cake everyday is for everyone.

Yea I think that article requires some context for reading. It's not for the novice, for the obese lifter, or for the lifter at the top of his/her weight class (who is not underweight)

Wow. I wish I could eat more like that. Ever since I was diagnosed with depression, my food intake started to decline. I love foods and eating was my hobby before. Haha. But, now, I barely touch the food.

Sorry to hear that, Arlene. OTOH, some folks with depression tend to overeat vs undereat. It's a tough one.

OK, I’m clearly not formulating my question clearly or I’m missing the point somewhere. 

So I’ll try again using this oversimplified example: assume an experienced lifter (not me!) is hitting a plateau or getting stuck, while he is already eating enough to allow for repair and muscle growth (because we assume he’s experienced and knows how to eat to grow, because that’s how he got to be this good in the first place. I’m talking about the type of lifters mentioned in the article about eating through the sticking point, not underweight people or people who think they eat enough but actually don’t.)

These people can overcome their ‘sticking point’ by eating a lot more.

So as I see it, this could mean
A) they actually didn’t yet eat enough, hence getting stronger by eating even more, or
B) there must be something else to explain this, because we assume they already eat enough, and an even bigger food intake would just lead to more fat (with perhaps just a little bit of extra muscle accompanying it?)
C) I’m plain stupid, and it’s something else, already mentioned elsewhere…

Please enlighten me 

Ah, I see now.

So- just to be clear I think that article refers to three groups of people:
1) group A (on your list)- the folks who actually haven't gained enough weight even though they think they did;
2) folks who are not yet at the top of their weight class who are not yet overweight (e.g. Ray Williams increasing his BW 10lbs does nothing to his total except for maybe hurt it, though losing 10lbs may hurt it transiently);
3) folks using significant amounts of anabolics whose weight gain is likely to contain a significant amount of LBM

[Dalton Clark]

OK, I’m clearly not formulating my question clearly or I’m missing the point somewhere. 
So I’ll try again using this oversimplified example: assume an experienced lifter (not me!) is hitting a plateau or getting stuck, while he is already eating enough to allow for repair and muscle growth (because we assume he’s experienced and knows how to eat to grow, because that’s how he got to be this good in the first place. I’m talking about the type of lifters mentioned in the article about eating through the sticking point, not underweight people or people who think they eat enough but actually don’t.)

Well. . . let's think about this. How likely is it that a trainee can be gaining muscular body weight (eating enough) and not be getting stronger (his lifts are stalled)? Now, I am a novice and don't squat 700 pounds, but I don't think this is very likely. This would be a situation in which additional muscle mass has not resulted in an increase in force production which would be bizarre to say the least. Any muscle fiber I have ever heard of can exhibit force well in excess of its own mass. It would be a very interesting situation for sure. So either they are exhibiting an adaptive response without introducing a new stress (heavier load) or they are not gaining strength with the addition of muscle mass. this seems unlikely.