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Thread: Pathetic press problems

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by 76now View Post
    The clean and press is the finest exercise bar none. No other exercise equals its total body involvement and the number of muscles involved. Taking the bar from stands reduces its value by more than half.
    How many older guys other than yourself have you trained?

  2. #12
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    How many older guys other than yourself have you trained?
    Trained some young up and coming olympic weightlifters. No one older. If someone asks i will make suggestions.

    I expected my opinion would generate considerable rebuttal and abuse.

    Do you refute my take on what the clean and press can do?

  3. #13
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    My 1 x 3 deadlift today was 195 lbs (glad I didn't have to grind 2 more reps), so I don't see much point in learning to clean my 53 lb overhead press. I'll just take it out of the rack. Doing sets of 3 on the overhead press also has the advantage of being able to do them all on one breath.
    Grinnell

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by 76now View Post
    Trained some young up and coming olympic weightlifters. No one older. If someone asks i will make suggestions.

    I expected my opinion would generate considerable rebuttal and abuse.

    Do you refute my take on what the clean and press can do?
    Most older trainees cannot use the clean and press, because the clean limits the movement. Therefore, they press from the rack, and most of them can actually do that well enough to incorporate it into their training.

  5. #15
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    Hey Rip. As usual, you are right.
    The clean and press is explosive, & not ideal for old bones and wobbly coordination.

    it amuses me though that younger-ish guys i introduced it to, find that 5 reps of clean and press is decidedly more grievous than a similar bout with deadlift or squat.

    Not of course that it should replace either, but anyone who won't fit it in on some of their routines is missing out on a good strategy.

  6. #16
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    (OP here) Well, thanks to all the good advice, I have gotten through my prior sticking point to 3 x 3 @ 84 on the
    bench press and @ 55 on the overhead press, now increasing both at 1 lb jumps. The NLP saga continues.

    My squat is back up to 3 x 3 @ 105. I was able to 'calibrate' the squat depth by setting the safety bars low on the
    rack and putting a thin fiberglass pole across at the proper depth (I use them by the 100s for the electric cross
    fences in the horse pastures). I couldn't 'feel' a bungee cord, but the fiberglass pole works for me. However,
    because I'm trying to "feel" for the pole, I'm doing 'pause' squats and not getting any bounce off the bottom.
    I'm debating whether to eliminate the pole on my work sets, but I worry that I'll go back to my previous problem of
    not going deep enough. I've been reading the thread on "box squats" with interest, but since I can't put any real
    weight on the pole I stay tight, just don't get the 'bounce'. My current thinking is that pause squats with the pole
    are more strict than trying to get/learn the bounce, but potentially not getting the full ROM.

    My deadlift is cruising along, just hit 200 lbs going at 2.5 lb jumps. My 74 year old, 130 lb, wife just pulled
    2 x 5 @ 112.5 lbs. (She has always been the athlete in the family, these "horse women" are tough.) My weight is
    up to 178, I've let the belt out 1 1/2 inches and my 34" Levis are feeling tight. I'm getting more grief about
    my new 'spare tire' from the wife, so I may have to cut back some on the groceries.

  7. #17
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    It's not really a bounce, more a stretch reflex. The way people talk about it gives the impression it propels you out of the hole effortlessly like a spring, but it doesn't, you can feel the tightness as a stretch if you are doing it right, so, once at the bottom of the squat at parallel you feel that stretch and immediately come straight back up.

    Took my wife weeks to finally hit depth and its better filming or having a spotter present rather than setting the safeties. I had her doing light goblet squats for weeks until she was able to get to depth, then adding the bar. It's important that you know where depth is by the stretch feeling, then it's automatic. The trouble with boxes and safeties is they provide a guide to depth, it's somewhat like trying to learn to ride a bicycle by riding a tricycle. The cross over has some limited usefulness, but it's no good being reliant on it. Concentrate on getting depth doing air squats if necessary, or even hanging onto a barbell on low pins for balance.

  8. #18
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    It is easier to squat to depth with weight on the bar. I usually don't get there with the empty bar warmups.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paulbfast View Post
    It is easier to squat to depth with weight on the bar. I usually don't get there with the empty bar warmups.
    Deffo not my experience coaching my wife. Things got decidedly worse with weight and then, when I asked questions, Rip savaged me for not ensuring she could get to depth right from the beginning of learning the technique. It's so easy to just dive in and think it can be figured out somewhere along the line, but instead it just grooves in bad form. My wife goes to depth now, with, or without weights.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nockian View Post
    Deffo not my experience coaching my wife. Things got decidedly worse with weight and then, when I asked questions, Rip savaged me for not ensuring she could get to depth right from the beginning of learning the technique. It's so easy to just dive in and think it can be figured out somewhere along the line, but instead it just grooves in bad form. My wife goes to depth now, with, or without weights.
    I think it depends. If it is a new trainee, as sounds like the case of your wife, and that trainee is lifting 45lbs (or similar) for working set, then absolutely I would expect proper depth as a requirement to moving up the weight.

    In cases where I've not quite hit depth with the empty bar (think within an inch or so of depth, not half squats), it was with a bar-only warm-up, and was due to the fact that I was not warmed up. Usually by my 2nd warm-up of 45lbs or maybe by 95lbs, I am at full depth, and if I were to go back to just the bar, it would be full depth. The issue here is NOT that I can't/don't go full depth with just the bar, it's that I have yet to perform the task that prepares my body for sets at full depth - the warm up. Also, I'm not advocating warm-ups at less than full depth. There's a good argument for not going beyond just the bar before you are getting full depth. For me, I know my body and know that if I didn't get it with just the bar, it will be there the next set.

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