Training twice a week, covering all 4 lifts Training twice a week, covering all 4 lifts - Page 4

starting strength gym
Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst ... 234
Results 31 to 40 of 40

Thread: Training twice a week, covering all 4 lifts

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Posts
    65

    Default

    • starting strength seminar december 2021
    • starting strength seminar february 2022
    • starting strength seminar april 2022
    Quote Originally Posted by Shiva Kaul View Post
    I agree - but shouldn't intensity anything precede volume anything?
    I guess this is now my question too, in light of everything that's been said thus far. If you're doing an Intensity lift and a Volume lift in the same workout, I think it stands to reason that the Intensity lift should go first, all other things being equal. Yes, you can get "used" to doing practically ANY workout order...but just because you can get used to something, doesn't make it optimal (as I've learned myself, many times throughout this process). Can you get used to the fatigue generated by a 5x5 squat session and still be able to finish your 5RM OHP after that? Yes, you can...but you can also "get used" to running 3 miles between your 5x5 squats and 5RM OHP, as the Crossfitters have shown us. That doesn't make it optimal. I'm honestly surprised I was doing my 5x5 squats before my 5RM OHP for as long as I was, without having problems. Why? I probably got used to it...and boy am I glad I smartened up and asked you folks some questions, because I've definitely learned some things from everyone's input.

    Thanks again, all!

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    silver spring, md
    Posts
    18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by skypig View Post
    I guess this is now my question too, in light of everything that's been said thus far. If you're doing an Intensity lift and a Volume lift in the same workout, I think it stands to reason that the Intensity lift should go first, all other things being equal. Yes, you can get "used" to doing practically ANY workout order...but just because you can get used to something, doesn't make it optimal (as I've learned myself, many times throughout this process). Can you get used to the fatigue generated by a 5x5 squat session and still be able to finish your 5RM OHP after that? Yes, you can...but you can also "get used" to running 3 miles between your 5x5 squats and 5RM OHP, as the Crossfitters have shown us. That doesn't make it optimal. I'm honestly surprised I was doing my 5x5 squats before my 5RM OHP for as long as I was, without having problems. Why? I probably got used to it...and boy am I glad I smartened up and asked you folks some questions, because I've definitely learned some things from everyone's input.

    Thanks again, all!
    This thread puzzles me. If you are stronger on your squat and deadlift, aren't you stronger on yours presses'. I always felt like the major compound lifts like squat and deadlift always developed my upper body even if i skimped on them a bit. I always new my bench and press were going up if my squat and deadlift were going up.

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Posts
    186

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by plumber View Post
    This thread puzzles me. If you are stronger on your squat and deadlift, aren't you stronger on yours presses'. I always felt like the major compound lifts like squat and deadlift always developed my upper body even if i skimped on them a bit. I always new my bench and press were going up if my squat and deadlift were going up.
    I'm happy to be the counter-example here: there was a time when I was squatting 430 lbs x 5 and I couldn't bench 135 lbs x 5.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    silver spring, md
    Posts
    18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by zft View Post
    I'm happy to be the counter-example here: there was a time when I was squatting 430 lbs x 5 and I couldn't bench 135 lbs x 5.
    Wow. Were you recovering from an injury?

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    North Texas
    Posts
    46,585

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by zft View Post
    I'm happy to be the counter-example here: there was a time when I was squatting 430 lbs x 5 and I couldn't bench 135 lbs x 5.
    Post a video of that 430 x 5.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Posts
    186

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by plumber View Post
    Wow. Were you recovering from an injury?
    No. I was just your prototypical totally underweight lanky recent high school graduate with a knack for squatting. I was a terrible eater and couldn't gain weight for the life of me, but somehow my squat just kept going up while my upper body lifts (predictably) stalled. I had zero upper body mass.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe View Post
    Post a video of that 430 x 5.
    Wish I could, but I no longer have any videos from back then. Best I have is this 190 kg x 5 set I did about a year later:

    190x5 on Vimeo

    but that was after I was told that I needed to squat high bar to do olympic lifting and had also managed to finally gain some weight and was probably benching something like 70 kg x 5. And if that set is hard for you to watch--believe me, it's harder for me to watch.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Posts
    65

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by plumber View Post
    This thread puzzles me. If you are stronger on your squat and deadlift, aren't you stronger on yours presses'. I always felt like the major compound lifts like squat and deadlift always developed my upper body even if i skimped on them a bit. I always new my bench and press were going up if my squat and deadlift were going up.
    Not sure what's puzzling you. I completely agree with you that strengthening your squat and DL will also strengthen your bench and OHP. The question is not about which lift is more important - everyone agrees that they're all important, and if possible, no lift should be neglected. The question is about which lift order is optimal when you are limited to 2 lifts a day. More specifically, if one lift is a Volume 5x5, and the other is an Intensity 5RM, does it make sense to do the Volume or Intensity lift first? And does the particular lift type (i.e. squat vs. OHP) affect your answer to this question, based on your experience?

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    silver spring, md
    Posts
    18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by skypig View Post
    Not sure what's puzzling you. I completely agree with you that strengthening your squat and DL will also strengthen your bench and OHP. The question is not about which lift is more important - everyone agrees that they're all important, and if possible, no lift should be neglected. The question is about which lift order is optimal when you are limited to 2 lifts a day. More specifically, if one lift is a Volume 5x5, and the other is an Intensity 5RM, does it make sense to do the Volume or Intensity lift first? And does the particular lift type (i.e. squat vs. OHP) affect your answer to this question, based on your experience?
    I've always done the larger compound lift first and then a press regardless of volume or intensity. I take a long enough rest so that i can do some type of pressing after squat or deadlift. For the last year or so I've been doing some variation of 531. This has been working. I will say that squatting or deadlifting first always helps my shoulders feel ready. If i start with a press first, in particular bench I don't usually do as well. I need time to warm up more. I have noticed that if really push my deadlifts all my upper body work responds better, even if i don't push as hard on them.

    I only have a couple of hours a week to train so i try to get the biggest return on my training. For me squat or deadlift and then bench or press.

    For me, in my daily life, its more important to have stronger legs and a stronger back than a bigger press. It helps a lot in humping around the equipment we do.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Posts
    65

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by plumber View Post
    I've always done the larger compound lift first and then a press regardless of volume or intensity. I take a long enough rest so that i can do some type of pressing after squat or deadlift. For the last year or so I've been doing some variation of 531. This has been working. I will say that squatting or deadlifting first always helps my shoulders feel ready. If i start with a press first, in particular bench I don't usually do as well. I need time to warm up more. I have noticed that if really push my deadlifts all my upper body work responds better, even if i don't push as hard on them.
    Thanks for clarifying! Huh, so interesting...everyone's experience with exercise order seems to be somewhat different. In your case, it sounds like you always do squat/DL first, and then upper body stuff afterwards. That was how I used to do my lifting as well, up until recently, when I started experimenting with doing Intensity upper-body lifts before Volume lower-body lifts. I guess the best I can do is keep tracking my numbers, and see how my lifting progress responds to this change. To be honest, I'm totally open to either method at this point, especially given the variety of experiences and opinions in this discussion!

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Posts
    65

    Default

    starting strength coach development program
    Quick update, for those interested - I did my squat/OHP workout today, using my "new" exercise order of 5RM (Intensity) OHP 1st, and 5x5 (Volume) squats 2nd. I ended up failing my OHP. This tells me that the 5RM OHP success I had with my previous workout was probably not due to the new exercise order, but just to my body getting a bit stronger from the previous (failed) attempt. I've been setting 5RM PR's for my OHP for quite some time and was definitely nearing my limit, so I'm not surprised that I've failed it now a couple times.

    However, this little cycle has taught me that in my personal case, it's probably not useful to change exercise orders, since 99% of my 5RM OHP progress was made while I was doing my "old" exercise order (Squats before OHP). If this exercise order has been driving progress for this long, and also matches the vast majority of the exercise orders shown in the blue and gray books, then that's definitely something I should not ignore.

    In short, I'll be going back to doing Volume Squats before Intensity OHP. Wouldn't you know it, I'm learning .

Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst ... 234

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •