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Thread: Intensity or Volume

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nathan Stewart 2 View Post
    So I realize now that I forgot that intensity is normally expressed as a percentage of one rep max, my bad, but it’s fine for the pourpse off my question, weight on the bar or percent of one rep max, both represent the stimulus of each work set rep.

    Intensity refers to the weight on the bar. Where in the SS books or website has it ever been described as a percentage of 1RM? For that matter, where has the percentage of 1RM been used except to explain that it's a constantly moving target, and therefore an estimate and not useful for much?

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nathan Stewart 2 View Post
    Thank you for the response, I think it’s a good peice of advice but maybe answering the question you think I should be asking, not the question I actually asked. I could be wrong and I frequently am, but I believe the first three questions, which I have read multiple times by now, refer to my specific recovery as a whole, the question I asked though is about which has a greater affect on recovery in general. Specifically intensity or volume. I’m not trying to get unstuck I’m trying to understand how these two training variables affect recovery in genaral.
    I thought you were asking about training while practicing MMA. First three questions is just a "make sure you address these first before trying anything else". The real answer to that dilemma was what I said after, a situational move to intermediate programming. As for how recovery is affected by volume and intensity, both have an effect, and both are things that need to be recovered from. The fact that they require you to recover from them is what makes them useful as training variables. But in your original posed dilemma, my first answer is valid. Removing volume or intensity from the LP beyond steps already outlined is not the answer to anything. The whole thing is very precisely balanced and if you play with it too much, usually you just end up ruining it. If you have other activities competing for recovery what you need to do is move to less aggressive programming that isn't having you up the weight on lifts multiple times a week.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nathan Stewart 2 View Post
    What has a greater impact on recovery, reducing the weight on the bar, or reducing the volume of work done? Just to make things simple let’s take an example, if I was doing a 5 by 3 squat at 250lbs and the next workout I’m suppossed to do another 5 by 3 at 255. What would increase recovery more, doing 250lbs 5 by 3 again, or doing 255lbs but doing a 5 by 2 or 5 by 1?
    Neither one has as great an impact on recovery as diet and rest. This is covered in the book you have not read.

  4. #14
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    You see Mark this is a guy who hasn’t read your books. Page 29 of practical programming 3rd edition, 1st revision.

    That’s the reason I said for example, but your post is otherwise thoughtful. It seems that the posters on this thread are not very good at answering questions in the abstract and tend to just always default to a set algorithm of answers like, “you haven’t read the book” or “the first 3 questions” when faced with a question that might make them think a bit. So thanks for your response, I basically agree, but I am going to leave a longer response to Rip to hopefully bring some clarity as to why I am asking this question in an abstract and very specific way. I was hoping to get an answer with out the long explanation but it seems I evitable to bring more clarity.

    I bet if you took the big 5 personality test you’d score real high in disagreabilty, aka low in agreeableness. It’s okay, I know you don’t give a damn what I think and I am the same way, low in agreeablness. Its a trait to be admired, truth and justice is more important then peoples feelings. But in correctness on this last one you would score low. As mentioned, two years ago I bought a hard copy of the blue and grey books. Since then I have read the blue book from cover to cover once, all except for chapter 7 (with the exception of the chin up parts) because I knew the chin-up would be the only Assistance Exercise I would be doing during my NLP. Recently I also bought the audible version of the blue and grey books as well and over the last few weeks I have reread the entire blue book on audio including ch 7. And I have read some sections of the grey book dealing with recovery specifically in relation to this topic and this question and I did all that before posting this question. So I may be a bottom 3%, I maybe wrong, happens a lot, but I am not going to let you get away with your, he hasn’t read the book excuse on this one. I may be incapable of understanding the book due to Neanderthal level IQ but I can read and I have read it. Now with that said, if your still with me, let my try to explain this question. I know you have the wisdom to help me if you can understand the full context. I have been active my whole life, but never strength trained, but otherwise considered myself active and healthy, served in the military, in AFG, and 4 years ago at the age of 31 during an Army training camp I developed sever chest pain while jumping out of a chinook into the Arkansas river and swimming to shore. Over just 2 or 3 weeks it went from a vauge tension to a distinct dull pain in my heart. Long story short I had a 99% in my LAD and had to get cracked open and have my mammary artery grafted into my LAD. Needless to say it was a life changing event that has set me on a path of taking my health seriously but also taking it into my own hands intentionally. So after first going low fat and taking all the meds, I quickly did tons of research on health and the heart, realized fat is not bad, went Keri for a while etc. Etc. That journey is what has led me to strength training, and part of what I learned in that time about the heart and heart desease is that most of what doctors say is bullshit, and that one pattern that is present in about 99% of heart attacks is chroniclly low heart rate variability (HRV) and an acute stressor. Since we cannot know when an acute stressor might arrive, one way of preventing a heart attack besides diet and strength training is monitoring and modulating HRV. HRV is a direct view into the central nervous system and incompases all the stressors that affect it including, mental and emotional stress, metabolic stress, alcohol, and physical training stress. So I decided that as part of my training I am going to monitor my HRV with an app called HRV4Training that is highly accurate, as accurate as the test a cardiologist would give you. So all that to say I completly agree with the first three questions as reguards to recovery, and I am closely monitoring all three. Do between 5 and 10 min between work sets depending on the exercise sometimes more when it feels tough and bar speed is slow, I am eating as much I can bare and actively seeking ways to I increase that part as it’s probably the hardest of the 3 for me with some digestion issues I have. And I am closely guarding my 8 hours of sleep sometimes more. However, when my HRV app says my HRV is very low and I should “limit intensity” in reference to my training I want to modulate my training accordingly to allow for some more recovery, and then hit it hard again when HRV is good, and really it’s good more often then not and I’m not using it as an excuse. I can tell you from experience that it is very objective, sometimes I feel like shit but if HRV is good I train hard anyway. If that makes me a pussy, frankly I don’t give a damn what anyone thinks anyway, I’m just trying to figure out what training variable is best to manipulate to speed up the recovery of my HRV which I suspect is realated to what we call recovery in training. Then I’ll give it hell when I’m adapting well to the overall stress in my central nervous system. Now before I get barraged with a scatter of sycophantry and narrow robot thinking I suggest anyone wanting to have this discussion educate themselves on HRV because the science in it is legit, it’s a powerful tool and it’s not going away anytime soon.

    I also forgot to mention that I have a job that requires that I do a lot of hard labor often out in the elements and that this also affects my recovery and HRV and again I am closely monitoring my answers to the “first 3 questions” but I am going to modulate trying to accommodate my HRV when it’s low in one way or another. Even if that means as mentioned moving into more intermediate type programming. However the only lift that I have failed reps on is the press. So I’m not sure if intermediate programming is appropriate yet… but I have also tried holding weight constant and also adding 5 lbs but reducing sets, mainly on the squat and deadlift when my HRV is low. But I can’t say that I could tell subjectively or objectively with the HRV score which would have helped more. It just slows progress when I hold weight constant and when I reduce sets, I didn’t notice much difficulty adding 5 lbs the next workout but I could see it potentially slowing progress too. But I don’t care about that, I am not trying to win a race, I’m trying to get healthy and I’m willing to slow progress when my HRV is low and for no other reason and I’ll get there soon enough. But maybe they’re are some things I’m not considering and my understanding of training is admititly limited. Any wise and well informed advice is welcomed.

  5. #15
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    Tell us what you ate yesterday. Everything, all of it. You like to type, so this shouldn't be a problem.

  6. #16
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    Dang! I actually hate typing and I typed this out and then the message got disappeared by some finger fumbling. Anyway, I don’t know if I can rememeber it all, but before breakfast, coffee with coconut oil and ghee butter. For breakfast I had 4 eggs smothered in shredded cheddar cheese. And 3 large 3 oz SBar smoked sausages which are essentially glorified hot dogs. I was aiming for enough to make a fist size of meat. That’s an exception because since I got married in June my wife never lets me cook, she just loves to cook for me but on the plus side she is Filipino and makes plenty of rice at almost every meal on the down side I’m constantly trying to get her too cook more meat. But yesterday was a rare time I cooked my own breakfast. Then for lunch and dinner I ate two decent sized bowls of what she calls “pancite?” Which is essentially rice noodles with chicken and vegetables. I know I snaked after that but I can’t remember what, I think chunks of cheese and Ckrackers. But I would consider yesterday less then what I’m typically eating.

  7. #17
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    You're not eating enough to get recovered. Like I said, diet and sleep.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nathan Stewart 2 View Post
    That’s the reason I said for example, but your post is otherwise thoughtful. It seems that the posters on this thread are not very good at answering questions in the abstract and tend to just always default to a set algorithm of answers like, “you haven’t read the book” or “the first 3 questions” when faced with a question that might make them think a bit.
    You are not a brilliant intellectual.

  9. #19
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    I think the question was along the lines of:
    For example, if my 1RM is 200 lbs Bench Press, my nutrition and sleep are the same, which would be harder to recover from:

    180x1x10 -90% 1RM /1800 lbs total/ with 3 minutes rest between sets

    140x12x3 – 70% 1RM /5 040 lbs total/ with 90 seconds rest between sets

    Personally, I find the larger volume more burdensome, even though the weight is lighter.

  10. #20
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    Yes, I agree, and like I said I’m actively working on that. First, I need to get some creatine, and whey protein so I can bolster my diet and then I am also planning to do some specific things with my diet to make sure I’m consistently getting enough protein and calories. I normally roughly follow the vertical diet, meaning my main staples are healthy read meat and rice, and then I add a lot of nutrient dense stuff on top of that, eggs, deer and beef liver, bone broth, and greens and many vegetables. What I want to do is get a calorie target, then use Santana’s fist protein tule of thumb and basically come up with a target calorie for protein fat and rice, and then titrate my rice intake up until I am taking in enough overall calories. It’s a bit difficult because I struggle with some obscure autoimmune issues that limit what I can eat without getting sick. For example I can’t use milk to boost calories or I have major problems. But the vertical diet foods don’t seem to give me any issues. I just got married in June and I started the program July so I’m still negotiating my diet with my wife and helping her understand my diet needs have changed dramatically. Thanks for the advice and I honestly take it to heart and will act on it, but again it’s less then helpful in terms of what I am going to do with modulating my training in a small time horizon according to my Heart Rate Variablity.

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