Shotput + Lifting?

[jfallon9]

Hello everyone. It has been quite some time since I’ve been on the forums, but I’m happy to say I’m back now and better than ever. I grew up some, took up shotput, and recently participated in my first meet. I threw a PR 30 ft. 10 in. just this past Saturday. In January, back when I got access to the football weight room, I ran Starting Strength for a month before they kicked me out once again! So, I took matters into my own hands and signed up for a gym membership near my house (got the membership as “payment” for helping my dad redo our kitchen, it’s been quite a few months since we started). Started doing a modified 5/3/1 split when SS became too difficult to recover from (I deloaded twice and still stalled at 275 x 5 x 3 squats). I made some decent progress with the program, taking my lifts from:

Squat: 275 x 5 —> 260 x 10

YouTube

Deadlift: 315 x 5 —> 300 x 8 (plates were 45 bumpers on each end, then 2 35’s on each side, then a 10 and a 2.5 on each end because weight room doesn’t allow iron plates on the floor for DL’s), also not counting 9th rep because it was hitched.

5/3/1 300 x 9 Deadlift - YouTube

Press: 135 x 1 —> 140 x 1 (not much progress here, I know)
Bench: 170 x 6 —> 185 x 4

Unfortunately, I have no video of the upper body lifts.

There is now some unfortunate news. I’m unable to go to the gym with a Squat Rack on a regular basis (and sometimes not at all during the week), and am stuck lifting with only a barbell and chin-up bar. For the past two weeks, I’ve been running a Tactical Barbell program using only deadlift, press, and chins 3x per week. I now have two questions.

1. Would you guys recommend I do any additional exercises to assist me with throwing? (that don’t involve a Squat Rack)

2. When summer comes, and I have a job, money in my pocket, an abundance of food, and time to train/eat/sleep correctly, should I give Starting Strength another go? Or would you guys recommend I switch to an HLM program as mentioned in PPST?

PS: I know that not Squatting is limiting my progress x1000. I’ve seen the power of squats, and I love them dearly. But, for now, I cannot squat.

Thanks for all your time, all input is appreciated.

Cheers

[Marenghi]

Hey, a rare and nice sport you got yourself there!

Well a little progress is better than no progress. Even if 5/3/1 didnt do that much for you at your level. Theres a reason to that, in this series Powerlifting Programs | PowerliftingToWin the program is reviewed in Better Than Before: A Review of Beyond 5/3/1 by Jim Wendler | PowerliftingToWin

- Check your DL technique. It seems youre dropping your hip. And youre quite rotated, also because of the mixed grip. As you dont compete in PL, you can use straps. Or you do grip strength training (might interfere with shot put technique training), use a hook grip (same caveat), more magnesia - or a sensible combo of those tweaks. Vid from the side to check back position.

- In a broader sense: you breathe the energy of youth, which is fine. Just be prudent enough to maximize your energy by not getting hurt by doing stupid things. Like bad technique. Because youll be way stronger with good technique being able to train more, harder, uninterrrupted by nagging injuries. Focus on checking and, if needed, correcting your technique from time to time.

- You can squat. Do unilateral squatting. Choose a variation that gives you the most stability. For some, that is a staggered stance, for others Bulgarian squats, for others simply split squats (front, active foot slightly elevated, similar to step-ups). If you can clean enough weight, you could do front squats. Weight vest and adjustable dumbbells would be a long-term investment that are also usable for other exercises (maybe in the summer, when youll get kicked out of the gym ). Jeffersen deadlifts are another possibility (start slowly, some dont like the asymmetric loading). Sumo deadlifts have a bit more knee extension, that might help, too.

- Yes, as you dont need high specificity, you can profit from slighlty more exercises than only DL, squats, chins, presses. You can do Power Cleans or jump squats (no rack needed for the low weights), strict rows ExRx.net : Barbell Bent-over Row or Pendlay Rows, and floor presses (no collars, very manageable weights, go for more set volume than to failure) or weighted push-ups (the better, albeit unpopular (because nastier) alternative).

- Program wise, you can choose one that in the linked program series is described as more general, for a (late novice to) intermediate level. For example any 4 day upper lower body split is excellent for your situation, as are more PL oriented programs with more exercise variation and volume: you profit from a broad base of hypertrophy and movements.

- By summer, you will be clearly too advanced for a novice program like SS. Look for intermediate programs, be it here or more advanced at RTS, Juggernaut, Geg Nuckols, Barbell Medicine, Eric Helms - whatever your personal goals will be then.

Have fun and feel free to ask questions on the road!

[jfallon9]

Thank you for all the advice! In the summer, I'll be able to regularly go to the gym I pay for (which actually has a Prowler and indoor turf). I'll also have money to buy food and get strong and conditioned. What's your opinion on Bill Starr's article:

Strength Training for Throwers | Bill Starr

Just found it yesterday. It's basically 5 x 5 incline press (instead of press), squat, and power clean as an HLM template.

[jfallon9]

Also, I've been learning hook grip. I'm hook gripping all my deadlifts in this training cycle.

[Marenghi]

Fine!

Bill Starr´s program: Its ok. Its a minimal program that gets extended after a few weeks like many other programs. For you I guess it doesnt make much sense without a bench now. And by summer, a combo of bench press and press gives a bit more varied stresses than the incline only (especially the press standing instead of sitting as in the incline bench). Also, a true strength hip-dominant exercise like any deadlift variation is a helpful component in a program. Of course the program always depends on how fatigueing your shot put training is and what your priorities are.

[jfallon9]

Thanks for the advice. Can’t wait for summer!

[Kyle Stevens]

Hey jfallon9, I coach high school track throwers and work a bit in our weight room. Stick with Starting Strength, run the Novice Linear Progression. No need to go to a HLM type template, get your strength levels up. The big lifts for you are your Squat and your overhead press. You get those lifts going up with good form and I promise your distance will go up as well.

I can't emphasize enough how much you need to just do the program. Nothing fancy, no assistance exercises. You lift to get strong and you practice your shot technique to become more efficient at throwing the shot. Don't get caught up in fancy programs or what great throwers do. Novice linear progression and work on your shot put fundamentals.

[Marenghi]

Kyle, he cant do the exact SS program (from an exercise selection point, he of course can still do a linear progression) because he doesnt have a squat rack and bench. And in four months when he will have access to that, he will be beyond the novice phase.

[jfallon9]

Hey, thanks for the input. I realize that Starting Strength is BY FAR the best option for me right now, but I can't get to a squat rack until the summer. On the upside, though, I've been pressing 3x a week. Also, I was just in the hospital with food poisoning, so I have to get back into lifting. I'm starting again tomorrow.

[jfallon9]

Also, I made a throwing circle in my backyard, and I've been throwing everyday. Hopefully, this food poisoning doesn't derail me too much. I've been trying to eat some eggs and foods with more protein (because I was sipping water and Pedialyte for the last few days), so hopefully that helps.