starting strength gym
Page 8 of 8 FirstFirst ... 678
Results 71 to 79 of 79

Thread: What program to do after SS?

  1. #71
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Sacramento
    Posts
    277

    Default

    • starting strength seminar april 2024
    • starting strength seminar jume 2024
    • starting strength seminar august 2024
    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Baker (KSC) View Post
    Yeah so the guys you see who can get away with programming super low volumes are typically more advanced in terms of their absolute strength. At the extreme ends of the spectrum you'd have a guy like a Karwoski who typically just worked up to one main work set on the squat once per week. But when you are squatting 800x5 that is an entirely different event than squatting 450x5. We're looking at stress - which is a derivative of both volume and intensity.

    But a single heavy set once per week is the extreme end of the low volume spectrum and is not going to work for most people. However, I've seen lots and lots of lifters make really good long term sustained progress on very moderate volume programming like what Andrew is describing. My strongest client is a thrower at the university of Oklahoma who I've trained since the age of 14. He squatted 500x5 at the end of his senior year of high school on a very low volume Texas Method program. One heavy set of Squats on his intensity day and 3x5@75-80% on his volume day. Increases in volume did not work for him. He now mainly trains on OU's strength program which is far higher volume than what we did here and all his lifts have gone down. And yes, he is drug free.

    I've gotten my best long term sustained progress out of clients who trained on fairly moderate volumes.
    Interesting, I've found programming for myself that I respond better to low volume squats and deadlifts at higher intensity, coupled with higher volume/ lower intensity for bench and press. But if I try to do any combination of benching/pressing on consecutive days, I am completely under-recovered no matter the intensity and feel like shit.44 year old male here.

  2. #72
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Kingwood TX
    Posts
    8,914

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisza View Post
    Interesting, I've found programming for myself that I respond better to low volume squats and deadlifts at higher intensity, coupled with higher volume/ lower intensity for bench and press. But if I try to do any combination of benching/pressing on consecutive days, I am completely under-recovered no matter the intensity and feel like shit.44 year old male here.
    The best program you’ll ever have is the one you design for yourself by training hard and paying attention to your body’s own unique trends

  3. #73
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    334

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Baker (KSC) View Post
    My strongest client is a thrower at the university of Oklahoma who I've trained since the age of 14. He squatted 500x5 at the end of his senior year of high school on a very low volume Texas Method program. One heavy set of Squats on his intensity day and 3x5@75-80% on his volume day. Increases in volume did not work for him.
    I read in one of your articles how explosive lifters have to limit volume, makes a lot of sense that any given intensity would be more stressful in an explosive athlete. Would your thrower (and Karwoski) supplement that low volume with a lot of assistance work?

    He now mainly trains on OU's strength program which is far higher volume than what we did here and all his lifts have gone down.
    Are they just not exposing him to >90% intensity enough, or ever?

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisza View Post
    Interesting, I've found programming for myself that I respond better to low volume squats and deadlifts at higher intensity, coupled with higher volume/ lower intensity for bench and press.
    I am not a coach, but I think this is fairly usual. Presses seem to like a bit more volume than squats. Have you tried including a few high intencity lifts alongside your volume?
    But if I try to do any combination of benching/pressing on consecutive days, I am completely under-recovered no matter the intensity and feel like shit.44 year old male here.
    This might be a more unique thing. I can bench (volume), then press, then bench (intensity) on three consecutive days, but I'm not 40 yet. I might walk in with some DOMS, but that dissipates during warmup.

  4. #74
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    2,266

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by convergentsum View Post
    I am not a coach, but I think this is fairly usual. Presses seem to like a bit more volume than squats.
    This is a common feature of exercises that fulfill the "3 criteria" less so than other exercises, and is expressed on a continuum.

    Deadlifts incorporate lost of muscle mass and cannot be done for a lot of volume (you can insert what "a lot" means here. I'm just trying to illustrate a concept)

    Presses incorporate less muscle mass and therefore can use more volume.

    A single joint exercise (like a preacher curl) can be done for a lot of volume. You can easily do 5x10 for preacher curls at your 11RM and you'll be mostly fine. Try that with deadlifts, and you will be much less fine.
    Starting Strength Indianapolis is up and running. Sign up for a free 30-minute coaching session.
    I answer all my emails: ALewis@StartingStrengthGyms.com

  5. #75
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Posts
    729

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AndrewLewis View Post
    This is a common feature of exercises that fulfill the "3 criteria" less so than other exercises, and is expressed on a continuum.

    Deadlifts incorporate lost of muscle mass and cannot be done for a lot of volume (you can insert what "a lot" means here. I'm just trying to illustrate a concept)

    Presses incorporate less muscle mass and therefore can use more volume.

    A single joint exercise (like a preacher curl) can be done for a lot of volume. You can easily do 5x10 for preacher curls at your 11RM and you'll be mostly fine. Try that with deadlifts, and you will be much less fine.
    I don't know if that's true ^.

    Because in SSNLP, you only press 3 times every 14 days.
    (i.e. press and bench have to 'share' the week)
    Those are tiny muscles groups.

    Squats use a fuckton of muscle mass IMO, but those we do 3x/week.

    Both are doing 3x5 for volume.

    Whats the thinking here then?

  6. #76
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    2,266

    Default

    You may be thinking of the exercises in isolation, when in reality, the exercises work together in both the muscular and hormonal response.

    For example, a very thin person will get bigger arms if they just squat and deadlift. Not only is there muscular overlap, but the hormonal response will force adaptation despite no mechanical damage being done.

    Also, just because we can do something doesn't mean we should do. If you can get away with 3x5 for presses and still make progress, why not do it?

    Eventually, in my opinion, presses and bench presses benefit from slightly higher volume than do squats and deadlifts.

    Does that clear up this apparent inconsistency/contradiction?
    Starting Strength Indianapolis is up and running. Sign up for a free 30-minute coaching session.
    I answer all my emails: ALewis@StartingStrengthGyms.com

  7. #77
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Sacramento
    Posts
    277

    Default

    I am not a coach, but I think this is fairly usual. Presses seem to like a bit more volume than squats. Have you tried including a few high intencity lifts alongside your volume?

    This might be a more unique thing. I can bench (volume), then press, then bench (intensity) on three consecutive days, but I'm not 40 yet. I might walk in with some DOMS, but that dissipates during warmup.[/QUOTE]



    I hit intensity sets for all lifts at some point in my programming. I've tried to add bench/pressing volume on a 4th day of a HLM and I can get it done, but it feels counter productive as everything aches and I can't move anywhere near as much weight.

  8. #78
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    334

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisza View Post
    I hit intensity sets for all lifts at some point in my programming. I've tried to add bench/pressing volume on a 4th day of a HLM and I can get it done, but it feels counter productive as everything aches and I can't move anywhere near as much weight.
    Well remember when you add an extra day you can afford to reduce stress per day quite a lot, and still have an increased stress per week. Should be possible to manage your fatigue sensibly. Maybe accessories and/or variations would help mitigate those aches? I use close grip bench for back-off sets after intensity bench, and i used to enjoy dips but don't do them at the moment as both my presses are moving without them. Incline presses and dumb-bell flat press look useful too, but i haven't tried them yet.

  9. #79
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Sacramento
    Posts
    277

    Default

    starting strength coach development program
    Quote Originally Posted by convergentsum View Post
    Well remember when you add an extra day you can afford to reduce stress per day quite a lot, and still have an increased stress per week. Should be possible to manage your fatigue sensibly. Maybe accessories and/or variations would help mitigate those aches? I use close grip bench for back-off sets after intensity bench, and i used to enjoy dips but don't do them at the moment as both my presses are moving without them. Incline presses and dumb-bell flat press look useful too, but i haven't tried them yet.
    I do all my sub max bench work as either paused or CGBP. I'll also add in LTE's when I can which seem to be the best press/bench accessory for me. Any accessory work never bothers me as long as it's on the same day as my regular lifts.

Page 8 of 8 FirstFirst ... 678

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •