DUP: Next block with less reps per set - how to adjust volume (number of sets) ?

[fabelweseN]

Hi, I've been doing this training block for actually months now as I was always able to make progress from week to week (we'll just take Bench as an example here):

Mon: 4x8
Wed: 5x6
Fri: 6x4 (AMRAP only on the last set)

I've started this block with 70% of 1RM for the sets of 8, 75% for the sets of 6, 80% for the sets of 4 and have been increasing weights from week to week depending on how many reps I'd get on the AMRAP set on Friday plus taking into account average RPEs.

I was able to increase my 1RM significantly from about 113 kg to 135 kg on the bench.

Now that progress has stalled a bit, I wanted to take a deload week and then go into the next block:

Mon: sets of 6 (starting @ 75%)
Wed: sets of 4 (starting @ 80%)
Fri: sets of 2 (starting @ 85%)

Now my question: I know Mike Zourdos talks about how in the grand scheme of things (within a macrocycle / over many months), volume should decrease while intensity should increase, therefore the drop in reps while going for higher % of 1RMs.

But what about the number of sets for the new 6/4/2 block now - should those stay the same (4 sets - 5 sets - 6 sets) or actually increase or even decrease? Should you be doing more sets than before because you've just dropped the amount of reps?

[Devyn Stewart]

Why are you doing DUP?

[Mark Rippetoe]

Looks like a question for Coach Zourdos.

[OZ-USF-UFGator]

Why not repeat your first block, adjusting for your new 1 rep max? Keep doing it until it doesn't work anymore.

[fabelweseN]

Why are you doing DUP?

Well because regular Linear Progression is not working for me any more (I'm not a novice any more with these numbers, I'd assume) , and because DUP works (obviously) , and I can do a lot of volume per week for the Bench with it which has helped a lot (low volume for Bench was getting me nowhere).

So anyone?

[DeanT]

I've been doing DUP now for several months. I was stuck at 330 on bench for 2 years before starting on DUP. I just hit 365 last week. Clearly it works. I'm currently doing this (bench programming only displayed below):
Monday: 11 sets of 6 at 67%
Wednesday: 5 slingshot singles from 85 to 100% followed by 10 reps at 85% in doubles (singles if necessary)
Friday: 28 reps at 77% in sets of 1-4 or 7 sets of 5 at 75% depending on fatigue from Wednesday.

I use 2 minutes rest on everything in order to keep time down. This is my current scheme...I've done many other rep/% combos. The one constant is that I need at least 100 bench reps per week to make gains.

[Devyn Stewart]

Well because regular Linear Progression is not working for me any more (I'm not a novice any more with these numbers, I'd assume) , and because DUP works (obviously) , and I can do a lot of volume per week for the Bench with it which has helped a lot (low volume for Bench was getting me nowhere).

So anyone?

I don't want to argue against a program that seems to be working for you, but in practical programming, DUP is kind of a last resort, once you've exhausted all other forms of quicker progression kind of program. If you just got out of LP, DUP probably isn't the best choice, and you'd probably be able to make quicker progress on a weekly or biweekly progression model first before DUP is made necessary.

If you're dead-set on DUP, this is probably a question for Michael Wolf in his programming section, not here for amateurs. Very few of us except the very advanced (myself not included) and some experienced coaches will know how to properly set up a DUP program.

[fabelweseN]

I've been doing DUP now for several months. I was stuck at 330 on bench for 2 years before starting on DUP. I just hit 365 last week. Clearly it works. I'm currently doing this (bench programming only displayed below):
Monday: 11 sets of 6 at 67%
Wednesday: 5 slingshot singles from 85 to 100% followed by 10 reps at 85% in doubles (singles if necessary)
Friday: 28 reps at 77% in sets of 1-4 or 7 sets of 5 at 75% depending on fatigue from Wednesday.

I use 2 minutes rest on everything in order to keep time down. This is my current scheme...I've done many other rep/% combos. The one constant is that I need at least 100 bench reps per week to make gains.

Nice program, the slingshot stuff would be a bit over the top for my training status though I'd assume
What would you say though about volume / number of sets when jumping into a new block?
"But what about the number of sets for the new 6/4/2 block now - should those stay the same (4 sets - 5 sets - 6 sets) or actually increase or even decrease? Should you be doing more sets than before because you've just dropped the amount of reps?"

I don't want to argue against a program that seems to be working for you, but in practical programming, DUP is kind of a last resort, once you've exhausted all other forms of quicker progression kind of program. If you just got out of LP, DUP probably isn't the best choice, and you'd probably be able to make quicker progress on a weekly or biweekly progression model first before DUP is made necessary.

If you're dead-set on DUP, this is probably a question for Michael Wolf in his programming section, not here for amateurs. Very few of us except the very advanced (myself not included) and some experienced coaches will know how to properly set up a DUP program.

I've been able to add +2.5 kg / 5 lbs to the bar pretty much every week since I started this DUP block, twice over the last couple months I had to repeat a weight, however a few times I was able to not only add +2.5 kg , but also a rep (e.g. 107.5 kg for 6 reps this week => 110 kg for 7 reps the next week), this is on the AMRAP set on Friday which is used to gauge progress.

I'm not sure any other program would've yielded me significantly better results, what more can you ask for than +2.5kg and a rep here or there basically every week? This is great progression for my level of advancement I would say.

Basically, Texas Method is a form of DUP also. It alters intensity and volume within a training week, from session to session. This is exactly what DUP is about, a program doesn't necessarily have to change the amount of reps you're doing from session to session to be called 'DUP', as long as it alters either volume or intensity (or both) from session to session, it is a form of Daily Undulating Periodization.

[DeanT]

Nice program, the slingshot stuff would be a bit over the top for my training status though I'd assume
What would you say though about volume / number of sets when jumping into a new block?
"But what about the number of sets for the new 6/4/2 block now - should those stay the same (4 sets - 5 sets - 6 sets) or actually increase or even decrease? Should you be doing more sets than before because you've just dropped the amount of reps?"

Slingshot is nice because it mitigates pec fatigue while giving you training stimulation in your triceps. It also allows you to handle supermax loads (this helps my mental game). As I said, this is just what I'm doing currently. It will only be around 4 weeks and then I'll move to a different rep scheme. Again, this is bench only.

I can't tell you for sure what will work best for you with reps at 6/4/2. I personally would do the following bench work at those rep schemes 7-9 sets of 6 (65-70%), 7 sets of 4 (75%) and 5 sets of 2 (85%). I would add an AMRAP CGBP set after the doubles. I would make sure to supplement my bench work with Chins, Hammer Curls, Rows and tricep work. I would do one accessory Monday and Wednesday and then 2 accessories on Friday. DL and squat would look much different than this.

I don't think most people here want to read about DUP programming so you can PM me and I'll try to give you some more detail.

[Satch12879]

I don't think most people here want to read about DUP programming so you can PM me and I'll try to give you some more detail.

I don't think that's the case at all. I'd like to read about it.

It's probably more accurate to say that people around here don't want to read about DUP programming rolled up into a screed about how SS is dogmatic, out of date, etc., etc. Basically, we'd like to have a conversation, not be lectured at.