Question regarding Relative Intensity and mediocre genetics

[deeprooted]

Hi Rip,

First off I want to thank you for putting so much time into doing what you're doing here and I also want to apologize beforehand for the length of this post.

I've been reading into PPST3 again lately and came across something I've been concerned and thinking about for quite a while now. I'm 27 years old, 1,80m tall and started working out with a skinny 61kg. I have autoimmune thyroid issues for which I get replacement thyroid hormones for years now and about 2 years ago I've started with barbell training and switched to a paleo/primal diet.

I've managed to get to 88kg now with the help of GOMAD while also adding a little belly fat (roughly 20-22% bf I'd guesstimate). I plan on reaching 90kg (my long-term goal) in the next few weeks and will then cut down a little because friends and family don't believe I'm doing this on purpose and are concerned I'm actually starting to get fat. Once I shed off enough of the excess fat and they finally get it I'll be back to gaining some more weight, that's for sure.

Anyway I'm doing the Texas Method Split routine as in PPST3 (but did almost the same routine with small changes in reps/sets already before the release of PPST3).

Before the split TM routines I tried the classic TM for a while but the 5x5 squats left me so exhausted that I simply lacked energy for the presses. It was very much like feeling strong on the first 3 reps on the presses and then suddenly lacking energy for the 4th and 5th. The other thing was that the 5x5 volume day made me feel like shit until about Thursday. I felt like it was too much systemic stress for my body. I was so sore on the light days that the 2x5 squats felt really heavy although I was using only ~60% of the weight.

Starting with the TM split I've gone for 3x5 for squats (and 4x5 for presses) instead of 5x5 because there's 1 day less of recovery anyway. The whole thing instantly felt way better. The bench and the press jumped up immediately and I didn't feel like I'm suddenly lacking energy on the last reps. Plus the 3x5 squats did give me a bit of soreness until Wednesday or sometimes maybe Thursday but I didn't fill like shit half of the week. And I was ready for Intensity squats and deadlifts on Friday. The thing is that as I've been "running it out" I've done 2x3, 1x3, 2x2, 5x1 intensity workouts as well and I always felt that I could do the lower rep sets better than the 5RMs despite the heavier weights.

My real concern though is that my 3x5 and even 5x5 weights are very close to the 5RMs. And by reading the various programs explained in PPST3 it doesn't seem right to me. Even my 5RM strength seem rather close to the 1RMs.

Here are my current lifts:
Squat: 140kg 3x5 as of today and I'm hoping to get 145kg 5RM on Friday (I'm not pessimistic but I want to point out the close distance between 3x5 and 5RM). I also did 150kg 2x2 three weeks ago.
Press: 70kg 4x5 and last week even 5x5 because I've been stuck on ID and 72,5kg would have been too much for VD. I managed 75kg for 5 singles and I'm stuck now at 77,5kg for 6 weeks (3 press cycles) doing only between 1 and 3 singles instead of the planned 5.
Bench Press: 92,5kg 3x5, never seem to get 95 for 5RM and actually never got more than 3 reps; 100kg for 5 singles and now stuck at 102,5 for 3 singles (failed at 4th) on last ID.
Deadlift: 152,5kg for 5RM. Previous 2x3 was 155kg and 1RM at 160kg but I'm sure they're both around 5kg higher now.
Power Clean: 5x3 72,5kg, 1RM 80kg so fairly little explosiveness.

I've also just read the Special Population/Women's section of PPST3 because I'm helping my gf and another girl doing barbell training. What stuck out to me was that part:

As a general rule, women do not have the same level of neuromuscular efficiency as men. There will be overlap between the top 30% of women and the bottom 30% of men, but men are, on average, stronger and more explosive than women. This is probably due to the differences in hormonal profile and the acute and chronic effects of much lower levels of testosterone, and it is evident across the spectrum of performance.

It is therefore recommended for women to switch from 3x5 to 5 triples once progress slows down because the stress produced by slightly heavier triples at the same 15-rep volume more closely resembles the effect males get from 3 sets of 5s.

Now I'm sure my hormonal profile isn't super bad but given my ectomorph body structure and chronic stress due to my autoimmune thyroid issue (and therefore surely elevated cortisol levels) I'm also sure they aren't stellar either. I know I'm far away from strong but I think I've reached some good numbers on my lifts thus far given my circumstances. On the other hand I felt like I always worked harder than most for it, giving everything and being 'dead' between sets and really needing my rest, never missing workouts, eating and sleeping enough. Actually I coached a friend of mine who is a couple of years older than me and he reached my size and strength in maybe half the time I did, while not caring much about eating, missing workouts regularly and not being so meticulous about form either.

So now given my questionable genetics, close together weights between 5x5 - 3x5 - 5RM - 3RM - 1RM and low explosive power I'm thinking whether triples or sets of 4 as a compromise would help me with my progress. And as I've already said lower rep sets on ID always felt better and more consistent to me despite the heavier weights.

Do you think trying out triples or sets of 4 are at least worth a try in cases like me or would it be just a waste of time and I better stick with and try to keep progressing on 5s?

[Mark Rippetoe]

Have you had your testosterone level checked?

[deeprooted]

Have you had your testosterone level checked?

I know it would have been helpful but unfortunately no. I don't have medical insurance at the moment (yes, even though living in Europe) so I have to wait for that for a while.

It's just guesswork here but from my observations I'd expect my testosterone levels not to be dangerously low but still on the lower end of the spectrum of what it should be as a man my age that's lifting weights. Given the chronic autoimmune thyroid issues, me being scrawny my whole life until starting to work out and going GOMAD, having milked out my linear progression rather early compared to what other people report here and having small joints (6.5" wrists finally after working out for a few years and gaining weight, 8.5" ankles). And just when I thought my lower legs at least don't look like sticks anymore I've seen my 13 year old cousin who has visibly thicker ankles and calves than me, while his height and whole body is as you would expect a boy his age to be.

[Mark Rippetoe]

If that's your problem, it will need to be dealt with.

[deeprooted]

So I assume this implies sets of 3s or 4s are not the way to go for men even if their neuromuscular efficiency (and/or hormonal profile) overlaps with the top 30% of women?

I didn't think too much of it but it seems that I do have to get my hormone levels checked. Although I still don't think my testosterone levels would be low enough to warrant HRT, just that they are in the lower end of the 'normal' range and I'm sure lifting heavy contributed to increase them a bit. At least there's some chest hair growing now. Err... maybe "a few chest hairs" would be more accurate. Very few. And still proud of it.

On another note I've switched back to 5RMs instead of 5 singles on intensity day this week and I've finally nailed the 95kg bench press. Then I also did a 4RM on the press with 72.5kg and I think I would've nailed the 5th if I hadn't done the bench PR before (but as I said it's still not spectacular given that I did 92.5kg as 3x5 on the bench and 70kg as 5x5 on the press).

[vanslix]

Is your thyroid problem (assuming Hashimoto's) being treated properly? Hypothyroidism can cause damn near anything to malfunction that is remotely related to metabolism.

[deeprooted]

Is your thyroid problem (assuming Hashimoto's) being treated properly? Hypothyroidism can cause damn near anything to malfunction that is remotely related to metabolism.

Yes, I'm taking T3 and T4 and I eliminated all grains from my diet in order to try reduce/eliminate autoimmunity as well. Last time I had my values checked the docs only checked for the TSH value though and not for any antibodies (which quite frankly is stupid in cases of autoimmune diseases), so I'm not sure yet if the attacks stopped or not.

The meds themselves make me feel a lot better and my metabolism should be normal but if the attack on the thyroid still occurs my cortisol levels would still be elevated due to the inflammation and this obviously would affect my testosterone levels negatively. This is actually why I think 5x5 on volume day squats don't work so well for me... too much total stress on my body at once.

[Dave M]

At least there's some chest hair growing now. Err... maybe "a few chest hairs" would be more accurate. Very few. And still proud of it.

So the program LITERALLY put hair on your chest? Nice.

Also had a side question: What exactly is your diet like? You said Paleo/Primal, but also said GOMAD. I'm asking because the description of your workouts sounds like some people who've tried to go low carb but would bonk out during workouts. Do other diets work OK with your thyroid condition? Is it possible you would feel better during and after workouts with more carbohydrates in the diet?

[deeprooted]

So the program LITERALLY put hair on your chest? Nice.

It literally did, yes. Just had to check and I even take that "very few" part back. ^^

Also had a side question: What exactly is your diet like? You said Paleo/Primal, but also said GOMAD. I'm asking because the description of your workouts sounds like some people who've tried to go low carb but would bonk out during workouts. Do other diets work OK with your thyroid condition? Is it possible you would feel better during and after workouts with more carbohydrates in the diet?

Paleo/Primal in the sense that I do eat dairy and don't misconceive it as "low carb" per se but that I avoid processed sugars. With the ~200g of sugar the milk provides every day plus the carbs that veggies and a few fruits contain it should be more than plenty to fuel my workouts. Plus I eat a ton of saturated and monounsaturated fats and the polyunsaturated that's within meats and fish.

Once I reach a size and weight I'm comfortable with (don't think I'll ever reach levels worth of competing) I'll stop the GOMAD but will include potatoes, rice etc. in my diet to fuel my workouts.

[k_dean_curtis]

deeprooted,

I had a bad case of Hashimoto's for 11 years. According to my Endo, a bad flu at 42 years old caused it. Thus, I know way more about this topic than one would care to. Below is what worked for me, you can find several resources on the web.

Training: be VERY careful about overtraining. Depending on your age, keep the frequency at 2 or 3 times per week, volume no more than 3 exercises for 3x5, but when run down, you must back off on the weight and intensity. You must cycle in down weeks, preferably at least 1 week per month. Never do 5x5, it will run you down quickly.

Diet: paleo with fermented dairy is best. Try to keep your body fat % under 18. This will mean cycling calories over weeks and months. The "anti-inflammatory diet" does help.

Supplements: 3 tbs coconut oil per day for T4 to T3 conversion. American ginseng (in bulk), from Kaiser farms in WI. Good multi with adequate selenium, not more than 200 mg. Zinc to help aromatase suppression.

Rx: Synthroid (do not take Armour, T3 is too high, will be great for a year or 2 then burn you out). Since suppressed thyroid drives down Testosterone you should also be on Angrogel/Fortesta with an estrogen blocker like Arimedex.

Sleep/Rest: 9 hours EVERY night, no exceptions. When under stress, you must seek peace and relaxation. Your parasympathetic nervous system is in a constant battle supporting your immune system. If one would have to rate treatment options, this is the most important of all.

You can be permanently healed of your autoimmune disease, but neither medical science nor alternative therapy will do so. I am walking proof of it, as are many others. If I tell you how, you probably will not believe me, but I know what happened to me and have seen it with many others. The Great Physician works every time! That is the only path to getting your health back completely instead of living with it.

God bless, HTH