Want to add a bit of strength training to oly program..

[DJC416]

**pressing. And need a bit of help figuring out a decent way to set it up.

My goals are 1) to improve my snatch & CJ, 2) to fill in the strength hole with no pressing. Ultimately I care more about my oly lifts, however I'd like to increase my upper body strength without it being detrimental to my sport.

My PRs atm are 87.5kg snatch and 100kg CJ (Ugly jerk but I've hit 100 nicer before) @ 83kg BW. Squat is ~150kg and front squat is 130 or 135kg. Base program to work around looks like this:

Mon: Snatch 80-90%, Clean&Jerk 80-90%, back extensions 5x10
Tue: Snatch(from hang) 70-80%, Clean(from hang)&Jerk 70-80%, back extensions 5x10
Wed: Snatch max, CJ max, back extensions 5x10
Friday: Front or back squat (alternate each week), clean or snatch pull 5x5, back ext 5x10

Tuesdays are not an "official" part of the program, it's just a class I jump in on and could be subbed/removed.

I have the option to do two-a-days(morning, afternoon) every day since I work at the gym I train at, and I know I need some more squatting and pull work in there, but my coach will throw those in when needed and I have faith that my oly numbers will go up - I'm just looking to throw in Bench & press 1x a week and maybe chins. I'm also going to add prowler 1-2 days/week, far away from my max and squat days so no worries there.

How would you guys set it up? Currently I'm thinking something like:

Thursday: Bench or Press 5x5
Saturday: Press or bench 3x5, Prowler
Monday morning: Chins 5x5, Prowler

On the other hand I could drop the chins since I'm getting in a decent amount of lat work already. Anyone here have any experience working around oly lifting? It is by far my preference but I need to do some pressin' at least once a week.. the bro side is calling..

[Les Hahn]

I haven't had experience with this personally, but there are a couple of people here doing it. Check out some of the log's (Nick's comes to mind, so does Mr_Rogers' for some ideas). I do think you can get away with doing the big lifts 1x per week and making gains. That is actually all I do right now (1x per week press, bench, squat, and DL) and they are moving up.

How good are you at the snatch/C&J right now? If you are still learning them, they will be pretty light and probably won't take too much out of you. As you get better at them, then you will have to be careful with your recovery ability/time. This is where 1x per on the slow lifts will probably help.

[DJC416]

Thanks for the response callador, ill check out some of their logs. I think the lack of responses is due to me having a coach and trying to lift behind his back.. hey, the guy did the same thing to his own coach back in the day, and he turned out to be an olympian heh. also i'd totally want to see you do some oly lifts.. maybe make a video for fun? haha

As you can see from the vids I still need a lot of work. However they don't need as much work as my basic lifts do, which i've neglected completely. which is the whole point of this post, just want to ease back into it a bit. i benched for the first time in 2 months on thursday and my chest is still super sore today (Sunday). That's not good at all heh. happy to report I actually didn't lose much off my max in the absence of any slow lifts (save for squat)

[Les Hahn]

That is good to hear. Just off my gut reaction, I would probably start with a 5x per week program (basically just adding the Thursday option) and take off Sat - Sun. As you adapt, then you could add the 6th or 7th day.

Worrying about recovery, I would use a strength system that is easy too. Something like the numbers from 5/3/1 or Karl's 5/3/1 might be a good place to start. Just don't overdo it by accident. Since you want to rotate the lifts (front/back squat, press/bench), maybe something like Westside could be useful for the strength days. Just hit your ME work and be done with it. This way you could rotate the lifts and still make gains on both.

Heh, you probably won't see me doing the quick lifts anytime soon! :-) I am hoping to make a real competitive run at powerlifting. Since I started really late (near mid 30's) there is no way I would ever be competitive in weightlifting. But powerlifting, guys are still making gains in their lower 40's, so that gives me the a good 10 year lifting window to see what can happen.

[PFerrari]

I think your plan looks good. I've benched/pressed on my light days in between my heavier snatch/c&j days. I typically rotate my pressing exercises - right now I'm doing push presses. Usually something like 3x5 or 5x5 depending on how I'm feeling. Seems to work well.

One thing I will caution is you have to really stay on top of your mobility work for your shoulders when you're benching. Pressing not quite as bad, but benching tends to get people all out of wack.

As a side note too, I'd say it would be good to throw in full clean & jerks and full snatches sometime between Wednesday and Monday too. I feel like going 4 days without doing a full lift doesn't work out the greatest - even if you just add some light stuff in. Just my opinion though - obviously you have a coach to listen to as well.

[Mr_Rogers]

My PRs atm are 87.5kg snatch and 100kg CJ

Awesome lifts DJC. I wish I lived in a place that had that calibre of coaching. You really are making great progress. I personally think you'll qualify for provincials next year for sure, possibly even this year as TO has a lot more options for meets (read that as ACTUALLY has sanctioned meets).

I'm really liking the auto-regulation Briks has me doing for presses. I OHP 1 set ARAP followed by 3 sets (8-12) of CGBP. Later in the week I bench 1 set ARAP followed by 3 sets (8-12) of OHP. For both 1 set ARAP the reps vary by week, I think it goes 8, 6, 4, 7, 5, 3, 4, 2 over an eight week cycle. If your coach has you doing training cycles you can play with the rep schemes to match the length of them. The 3x5 did not work me as well as this has. The Medvedyev text I'm reading suggests the Russians pressed during their training quite regularly. I didn't seen flat bench press mentioned, but I did see incline bench press mentioned as well as OHPs from various grips. They also did a ton of low (bend overs, back ext, etc.) and dedicated upper back work. I'd be hesitant in adding in more work than just the presses though. When I've done that I've had utterly horrible results, but I'm also 31 with shit recovery. I don't think you'd have an issue adding in 2 days of presses a week.

[DJC416]

Heh, you probably won't see me doing the quick lifts anytime soon! :-) I am hoping to make a real competitive run at powerlifting. Since I started really late (near mid 30's) there is no way I would ever be competitive in weightlifting. But powerlifting, guys are still making gains in their lower 40's, so that gives me the a good 10 year lifting window to see what can happen.

There's no doubt in my mind that you're going to be a great powerlifter Les. I have the utmost respect for powerlifters - I mean, damn, starting strength was hard but the stuff you guys do is intense as hell. I actually miss linear / programmed progression a lot

I think your plan looks good. I've benched/pressed on my light days in between my heavier snatch/c&j days. I typically rotate my pressing exercises - right now I'm doing push presses. Usually something like 3x5 or 5x5 depending on how I'm feeling. Seems to work well.

One thing I will caution is you have to really stay on top of your mobility work for your shoulders when you're benching. Pressing not quite as bad, but benching tends to get people all out of wack.

As a side note too, I'd say it would be good to throw in full clean & jerks and full snatches sometime between Wednesday and Monday too. I feel like going 4 days without doing a full lift doesn't work out the greatest - even if you just add some light stuff in. Just my opinion though - obviously you have a coach to listen to as well.

This is all great advice. I do see a lot of great oly lifters doing push presses, usually behind the neck too. I should throw them in sometime.

Benching definitely messes with your shoulders - I benched thursday, and I definitely wouldn't be able to snatch comfortably all the way through sunday. If it continues to be a problem I'll just drop em for more presses / push presses.

You're definitely right about throwing some light work in there. I'm going to talk to my coach tomorrow about a good way to set it up, if nothing I can just do stuff at 50-60% or even less. Today (monday) my lifts were frustratingly garbage and its definitely from the lack of practice. I wanted 105 today so bad too, after the in-house meet on Wednesday (thats where the vids are from).

Awesome lifts DJC. I wish I lived in a place that had that calibre of coaching. You really are making great progress. I personally think you'll qualify for provincials next year for sure, possibly even this year as TO has a lot more options for meets (read that as ACTUALLY has sanctioned meets).

Thanks man.. you know how it is. It's never fast enough heh. I'd be happier if my light days were programmed as light days, but inconsistency drives me nuts, especially when there are smaller / less dedicated guys around me PRing left and right. My coach thinks i'll qualify either this year or the next.. I'm definitely shooting for this year. Gotta definitely ramp up the training if I expect to add another 30-40kg these next few months.

[/QUOTE]I'm really liking the auto-regulation Briks has me doing for presses. I OHP 1 set ARAP followed by 3 sets (8-12) of CGBP. Later in the week I bench 1 set ARAP followed by 3 sets (8-12) of OHP. For both 1 set ARAP the reps vary by week, I think it goes 8, 6, 4, 7, 5, 3, 4, 2 over an eight week cycle. If your coach has you doing training cycles you can play with the rep schemes to match the length of them. The 3x5 did not work me as well as this has. The Medvedyev text I'm reading suggests the Russians pressed during their training quite regularly. I didn't seen flat bench press mentioned, but I did see incline bench press mentioned as well as OHPs from various grips. They also did a ton of low (bend overs, back ext, etc.) and dedicated upper back work. I'd be hesitant in adding in more work than just the presses though. When I've done that I've had utterly horrible results, but I'm also 31 with shit recovery. I don't think you'd have an issue adding in 2 days of presses a week.[/QUOTE]

This seems like a good scheme to try out, almost 5-3-1ish. I'd definitely give it a swirl, the idea of auto-regulation for what's solely assistance is sound. Our programming has been the same for the past 2 months, a 1 week cycle (well swapping front/back squats and clean/snatch pulls each week). I messed up in the OP though, we max out on mondays as well. Couldn't hit 85kg snatch today.. oarghh

[PFerrari]

Benching can be fine for a lot of people just make sure you stay on top of your mobility shit. MobilityWOD internal rotation mash with a barbell works wonders for me after I do any benching/pressing. Don't just sub out an exercise just because you're too tight from it. If you're too tight, stretch more. (Of course, that implies that the exercise helps you with your sn/cj or you just like doing it for other reasons).

[Mr_Rogers]

PFerrari - are any of these them?

http://www.allthingsgym.com/shoulder...n-mwod-series/

[PFerrari]

PFerrari - are any of these them?

http://www.allthingsgym.com/shoulder...n-mwod-series/

Yeah I absolutely love the 1st one barbell shoulder smash. I also like doing a similar thing at home on the wall or floor with a lacrosse ball. Looks idiotic but I live alone so it's fine!