Power Snatch Form Check

[UpsideDownChuck]

Not sure if I can post these here but it is an alternate exercise for starting strength and is mentioned in a lot of the intermediate training stuff. I've been trying to do power snatches and am struggling with them. I think from watching the video's I'm bending my arms too early but when I try to keep them straighter longer I am unable to get the bar overhead.

Here are the video's
6x2x115

WS1: YouTube (side view)
WS4: YouTube (front view)
WS5: YouTube (front oblique view)
WS6: YouTube (front oblique view)

If someone could please help that'd be awesome

[IlPrincipeBrutto]

Hello Chuck (can I call you that?),

Good news first: you're strong enough to Snatch that weight without problems.

I think you need to make a few changes, some easy, and at least one which might not be.

First the easy parts; I would bring my heels in a little bit, say a couple of inches. Also, I think you could afford to experiment a bit with your grip and widen it, but this is just a suggestion.

Also, you might want to try and turn your elbows backward, locking your triceps, and keep them there for the duration of the pull.

The hardest part is that the rhythm of your movement is a bit off; you are too impatient.

First of all, you first pull should be a hip movement; feel your hips raising, and keep your back angle to the floor constant. In other words, keep your shoulders over the bar. When the bar reaches the top of your knees, your shoulders should still be over it.
Then, the waiting bit; you need to wait until the bar travels from the top of the knee to the 'go!' position. A good 'go!' position is higher than you think. Top athletes explode when the bar is in their groin, in the crease between legs and torso (a wide grip helps reaching this position); the general rule is to wait until the bar is high enough.

The trouble with this phase is that as you wait for the bar to reach high on your thigh, your brain will start screaming "it's too late, it's too late, there is not enough space left to explode, we need to go now". And you'll go way too early.
And because you go too early, you need to bend your arms, which is what you do.

You have to wait.

Once the bar reaches the right point, you still have to jump right upwards (rather subtle difference compared to banging your hips forward) keeping your arms straight, then shrug your arms back while diving under the bar and then re-straighten your arms in the lock out position.
It's all quite complex, and will take a bit of practice. But I think the most important thing for you right now would be to fix that first pull and learn to be patient before pulling the trigger.

Once that is fixed, adding the rest is easier. But if the rhythm is wrong, no amount of tweaking will make much difference.

Hope this helps,

IPB

[UpsideDownChuck]

Chuck is fine, and thanks. I kind of see that now in looking at the stills, your description of what's going on with the brain and being impatient definitely matches my experience. I'll try to tell my brain to shut up and see if I can get that to work. Thanks again.

[IlPrincipeBrutto]

Chuck is fine, and thanks. I kind of see that now in looking at the stills, your description of what's going on with the brain and being impatient definitely matches my experience. I'll try to tell my brain to shut up and see if I can get that to work. Thanks again.

Cool.
Just to reiterate, also make sure you keep your shoulders over the bar during the first pull.

IPB

[Matthew Phoenix Pennisi]

I think from watching the video's I'm bending my arms too early but when I try to keep them straighter longer I am unable to get the bar overhead.

When I snatch, I have to make sure that after I explode, I dip back under the bar so that my elbows have time to extend and lock out to catch the bar. I experimented with the cue to "Sit Down!" after jumping and it helped me out.

[UpsideDownChuck]

Ok thanks guys. I'll try to do both of those as well. As of right now I'm power snatching once a week so it won't be til next Saturday that I do any, but maybe I'll try to squeeze some in mid-week

[UpsideDownChuck]

Did some more power snatches today at 95 lbs. Tried to keep arms straight until the jump, and tried to keep shoulders over bar later.

Reps I thought were good in parens

Set1: YouTube (1)
Set2: YouTube (1)
Set3: YouTube (1)
Set4: YouTube (none)
Set5: YouTube (1)
Set6: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aNQyyeTzF7M (1,2)

In typing this it seems like the first rep is generally better than the second. Maybe I should take a second longer to focus on the second.

[IlPrincipeBrutto]

In typing this it seems like the first rep is generally better than the second. Maybe I should take a second longer to focus on the second.

Not seen videos yet, but I can comment on this bit.
In my experience (not saying much, I know), the PS is very sensitive to the position of the bar relative to the feet. Too far in front, of too far back, even by a small amount (3/4 in) and the first pull goes awry, with predictable consequences on the rest of the lift.
In a multi-rep set, the first lift benefits from perfect placement, and it's usually good. For subsequent reps, the bar might not be in the perfect position, unless I put it back on the floor, let go of it, stand up and re-place myself.

To sum it up; if you do a set without letting go of the bar, bar placement after the first rep might not be optimal, affecting the lifts. A possible solution is to reset after every rep; this changes a set of N into N singles separated by a very brief rest.
Up to you to choose between setup accuracy and intensity of the set.

Personally, I don't let go of the bar for light and medium sets. When the weight gets heavy, I now prefer to reset and get an accurate lift.

Hope this helps,

IPB

[IlPrincipeBrutto]

Hello again,

had time to watch some videos, here's my thoughts.
The first pull has improved; you also have less arm-pulling.
Still need to find consistency in the explosion, but that will come.
Problems have moved upstairs, namely in the lock position.

Not sure if deliberate or not, but what you are doing is sitting bolt upright under the bar. When you receive the bar, your hips are over your heels, your torso is pretty vertical, and the bar is basically above your head.
To accomodate this position, you have to jump forward a lot, or chase the bar after getting up.

You want your lock position to resemble a bit more an Overhead squat (try doing a few of those with the empty bar; a few reps are worth a thousand words): hips low (lower than now; no need to go below parallel), arse behind heels, torso inclined forward, arms thrusted back and up (*relative to neck/torso*), vertical of the bar behind your head.

At the start, receiving the bar in that position can be a bit daunting, but it's worth trying.

Hope this helps,

IPB