Squat check at 325lb

[Jr_Geezer]

Just for the record: 57 yo, 5'11, 210 lbs

Here's the third set of fives at 325 yesterday: YouTube

You think you're doing OK form-wise and then you finally get around to getting someone to video you and you see you were quite mistaken. Lousy depth, massive knee slide and who knows what else. In my defense, I'm still feeling effects from a back injury and a tight right quad/adductor so the main thought going through my mind here is "Am I going to tear something or is my back going to go?". (Details of injury can be found in some threads I've started in the Recovery forum.) My stance is slightly narrower than usually because I wanted to reduce the strain on my adductor a bit. Doesn't really look like it, but I am making a good firm Valsalva.

Looks like time for another visit to the local SSC.

Thanks for any and all input.

-RJP

[IlPrincipeBrutto]

Hi there,

at the risk of sounding like an a***hole, it looks to me as if you are not actually hitting depth, although it might be the camera angle.

IPB

[Jr_Geezer]

Hi there,

at the risk of sounding like an a***hole, it looks to me as if you are not actually hitting depth, although it might be the camera angle.

IPB

Well, as I said in my post, “lousy depth”. I hope it’s the camera angle, but I don’t think so. I was also hoping someone would say the depth is fine, but no, I don’t think it is.

-RJP

[Jr_Geezer]

Well, as I said in my post, “lousy depth”. I hope it’s the camera angle, but I don’t think so. I was also hoping someone would say the depth is fine, but no, I don’t think it is.

-RJP

BTW, I certainly wouldn’t think of you as an a****** if you pointed out the obvious. That’s why I posted. I appreciate your input.

-RJP

[Bryan Bulmann]

Just for the record: 57 yo, 5'11, 210 lbs

Here's the third set of fives at 325 yesterday: YouTube

You think you're doing OK form-wise and then you finally get around to getting someone to video you and you see you were quite mistaken. Lousy depth, massive knee slide and who knows what else. In my defense, I'm still feeling effects from a back injury and a tight right quad/adductor so the main thought going through my mind here is "Am I going to tear something or is my back going to go?". (Details of injury can be found in some threads I've started in the Recovery forum.) My stance is slightly narrower than usually because I wanted to reduce the strain on my adductor a bit. Doesn't really look like it, but I am making a good firm Valsalva.

Looks like time for another visit to the local SSC.

Thanks for any and all input.

-RJP

Hey RJP,

I'll throw in my $0.02; but understand that's about all my opinion is worth. From what I can see, (and the angle isn't the best; so I may be incorrect), your heels appear to come off the ground a bit at the end of the eccentric. Do you feel as if the weight is a bit forward of your midfoot? I ask because I have pulled my own groin muscles too many times to count over the last three years because of the bar going just forward of midfoot. My correction has been to not lean forward as much on my descent. In other words, instead of 'sit back'; I tell myself to 'sit down'. Also, I try really hard to pay attention to the pressure of the bar on my feet and make sure I don't feel it in my toes. It's really hard to stay more vertical, but I think it may also help with your depth as well.

Since I've been doing this, my groin tweaks have drastically been reduced. Hope this helps or, at the very least, doesn't hurt! I remember being jealous of your numbers prior to your injuries; as I am 4yrs your junior. Kudos to you for continuing to push through!!! Very inspirational, sir!

[Jr_Geezer]

Hey RJP,

I'll throw in my $0.02; but understand that's about all my opinion is worth. From what I can see, (and the angle isn't the best; so I may be incorrect), your heels appear to come off the ground a bit at the end of the eccentric. Do you feel as if the weight is a bit forward of your midfoot? I ask because I have pulled my own groin muscles too many times to count over the last three years because of the bar going just forward of midfoot. My correction has been to not lean forward as much on my descent. In other words, instead of 'sit back'; I tell myself to 'sit down'. Also, I try really hard to pay attention to the pressure of the bar on my feet and make sure I don't feel it in my toes. It's really hard to stay more vertical, but I think it may also help with your depth as well.

Since I've been doing this, my groin tweaks have drastically been reduced. Hope this helps or, at the very least, doesn't hurt! I remember being jealous of your numbers prior to your injuries; as I am 4yrs your junior. Kudos to you for continuing to push through!!! Very inspirational, sir!

Thanks for the input and kind words.
Good eyes. If you could see in my log book how many times I’ve written “Sit back!” Maybe I’ll try the “Sit down” cue instead. I just have to figure out how to do that consistently. I remember when I tore my adductor, the rep before the tear had me going well forward and probably the same on the rep that tore it.

-RJP

[Bryan Bulmann]

I hope that cue works for you as well as it did for me. When I would 'sit back', I would end up closing my hip angle too much, causing the barbell to pitch too far forward. Not having very good thoracic extension didn't help things either and the bar would roll ever further forward!

In order to correct my thoracic problem, I have to tell myself 'shoulders back -- puff out chest'. I also gaze further out than the normal SS recommendation. That helps with both thoracic issues and allows me to keep a more vertical back.

I feel like I'm front squatting, but video shows a pretty decent bar path right over the mid-foot. Andy Baker noted that my femurs were 'short' for my 6'0" frame....and that anthropometry demands a more vertical back angle to keep weight over mid-foot.

(To be clear, I did NOT notice any problems with your thoracic extension.)

PS--For the record I am STILL jealous of your squat #!

Good luck, RPJ!

[Bekah Cygan]

Hey there! Nice work on these squats! 325 is moving really well for you.

It has been my experience as a coach and lifter- that one can never be too confident that you have finally arrived with squat form! lol. Good for you for filming yourself to keep everything accountable- and awesome that you have a local SSC to see in case of emergency!

I would recommend seeing the coach if you can, these things are always fixed more quickly by your favorite SSC. Here are a few tips to work on in the mean time....

Low Back Position-

I will take your word for it that you are taking a good Valsalva, but in general- it is not good that you arch your back- after un-racking the bar. Can you see yourself do it? Getting your back tight in this order (after you have taken the bar out of the rack) usually leads to one of two things... 1) not getting your back tight enough (it is harder to make your spine neutral while under the compressive forces of 325) or 2) Hyperextending your back- which is what is looks like is happening to you here. Get tight before you un rack the bar and only take a quick top off kind of breath before you begin your rep. Your back and elbow position shouldn't change. Ironically- hyperextension of the back can lead to adductor troubles- so it is worth a fix for you it sounds like!

Here is a video about getting tight under the bar that I made with SSC Caleb Krieg
YouTube

Knee Position-

Your knees are sliding because at the top of the squat you are initiating the descent by sticking your ass back and keeping your knees back. Your knees are then in a position to play catch up all the way to your bottom position where they have to slam forward to keep your body in balance- pushing your weight forward. When you begin your descent- your hips should go back AND your knees should go forward. Then you think about sitting down. The knees should be in place 1/3 of the way down for you and your build. Break the hips and knees into place at the same time, as soon as you start down.

3) Bury it deep! Though I think if you fix issue number 2 your depth will take care of itself!

Good luck!

[Jr_Geezer]

Hey there! Nice work on these squats! 325 is moving really well for you.

[all sorts of good advice snipped]

Good luck!

I don’t have time for more of a response, but this is awesome, thanks for the advice. Definitely be incorporating it in my next workout.

-RJP

[Bryan Bulmann]

Hey there! Nice work on these squats! 325 is moving really well for you.

It has been my experience as a coach and lifter- that one can never be too confident that you have finally arrived with squat form! lol. Good for you for filming yourself to keep everything accountable- and awesome that you have a local SSC to see in case of emergency!

I would recommend seeing the coach if you can, these things are always fixed more quickly by your favorite SSC. Here are a few tips to work on in the mean time....

Low Back Position-

I will take your word for it that you are taking a good Valsalva, but in general- it is not good that you arch your back- after un-racking the bar. Can you see yourself do it? Getting your back tight in this order (after you have taken the bar out of the rack) usually leads to one of two things... 1) not getting your back tight enough (it is harder to make your spine neutral while under the compressive forces of 325) or 2) Hyperextending your back- which is what is looks like is happening to you here. Get tight before you un rack the bar and only take a quick top off kind of breath before you begin your rep. Your back and elbow position shouldn't change. Ironically- hyperextension of the back can lead to adductor troubles- so it is worth a fix for you it sounds like!

Here is a video about getting tight under the bar that I made with SSC Caleb Krieg
YouTube

Knee Position-

Your knees are sliding because at the top of the squat you are initiating the descent by sticking your ass back and keeping your knees back. Your knees are then in a position to play catch up all the way to your bottom position where they have to slam forward to keep your body in balance- pushing your weight forward. When you begin your descent- your hips should go back AND your knees should go forward. Then you think about sitting down. The knees should be in place 1/3 of the way down for you and your build. Break the hips and knees into place at the same time, as soon as you start down.

3) Bury it deep! Though I think if you fix issue number 2 your depth will take care of itself!

Good luck!

^^This. Soooooo much more insightful & helpful than what I said. Keep us posted with your progress RPJ! I'll be testing some 1RM's myself this week and can't wait to try out some of the tips in Bekah's & Caleb's video.