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Thread: Lose weight before starting?

  1. #41
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    Sep 2017
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    • starting strength seminar april 2024
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    I’m 5 feet 10 inches tall.

    Jeremy the main two reasons are:

    1. I’m tired of being fat, feeling like shit, and having to buy bigger clothing each year.

    2. I read Dr Sullivan’s barbell prescription book. Quite honestly I don’t want to be the aging phenotype he talks about.

    One of the general fitness attributes he mentions is body composition, and a need to reduce visceral fat which I have plenty of.

    This was the big reason for this post. I know you CAN loose fat while building muscle but they are co pletly different things.

    I just thought maybe losing the fat first and then going all in on starting strength. Or swinging a kettle bell twice a week in between strength training.

    Other than shift work, I have plenty of free time, no kids or other stresses, and have the luxury of eating whatever I need to. (Currently it’s whatever I wanted).

    I’d say I do not have an eating disorder. I have a life disorder. I have the time, certainly the equipment (that’s sat unused for 13 years), money.

    Done is better than perfect. I love that! I need to be that.

    My disorder is learning. I’m a sponge. I crave learning how to do things, and how things work.

    When I learned about solar for the off grid cabin, I knew more than people who worked the business for 20 years.

    When it’s was time for a new roof, I needed to know more about roofs than any human needs to know.

    I’ve walked into stores and in addition to walking out with a product, I’ve had job offers because I know more than the sales staff.

    I’ve basically sold a car at a dealership because a potential customer wanted a brochure. It happened to be the car I was looking at.

    Some days I can spend up to 16 hours online reading, watching you tube, and visiting forums learning. In fact I’m doing it right now, lol.

  2. #42
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    Oct 2017
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    Jackson, MS
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    Quote Originally Posted by dhurstell View Post
    Preach!
    Ha, ha! I'm trying. But for every person I can get to come get under the bar with me I lose two to a trainer and the inevitable one-legged swiss ball body weight squats!

    There is something about barbells that is mentally challenging to people. I guess the idea of it, or maybe the perception of it? I don't understand it and therefore can't wrap my brain around what to say to counter it. It's not even the fear of turning into the Hulk or something. It's something else. Like Jeremy, I get that people have to get their head around why they are doing this. But in practice, I know that sometimes that doesn't come until later. Frankly, I started "weight training" because I was lazy and fat. Standing still lifting heavy shit was easier than running on the treadmill. I didn't really "get it" until a while later. So while that may be a part of it I don't think it's the whole thing. If I could find the right words or ideas to break that mental block people have I'd be really happy.

  3. #43
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    Nov 2009
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    South of France
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    Hi Jenni,

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenni View Post
    There is something about barbells that is mentally challenging to people... If I could find the right words or ideas to break that mental block people have I'd be really happy.
    IMHO, I think there is some sort of mental defense mechanism at work, and that applies not just to barbells bu to any idea that radically changes one person's self-perception.
    For someone who has trained for years using machines, bosu balls and glossy magazine protocols, switching to barbell training is not painless. It would mean accepting that all those years, all that effort had been ineffective; it would mean admitting that they have been duped, conned. People might have built a mental picture of themselves as someone healthy, fit, strong; the moment they get under a loaded bar, that picture crumbles, and that's never very easy to accept.
    I think that some people know this, they feel it deep inside them, and they'd rather keep the image of their self intact, rather than going through the pain of admitting it was a fantasy.

    IPB

  4. #44
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Uk
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    1,468

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bean438 View Post
    I’m 5 feet 10 inches tall.

    Jeremy the main two reasons are:

    1. I’m tired of being fat, feeling like shit, and having to buy bigger clothing each year.

    2. I read Dr Sullivan’s barbell prescription book. Quite honestly I don’t want to be the aging phenotype he talks about.

    One of the general fitness attributes he mentions is body composition, and a need to reduce visceral fat which I have plenty of.

    This was the big reason for this post. I know you CAN loose fat while building muscle but they are co pletly different things.

    I just thought maybe losing the fat first and then going all in on starting strength. Or swinging a kettle bell twice a week in between strength training.

    Other than shift work, I have plenty of free time, no kids or other stresses, and have the luxury of eating whatever I need to. (Currently it’s whatever I wanted).

    I’d say I do not have an eating disorder. I have a life disorder. I have the time, certainly the equipment (that’s sat unused for 13 years), money.

    Done is better than perfect. I love that! I need to be that.

    My disorder is learning. I’m a sponge. I crave learning how to do things, and how things work.

    When I learned about solar for the off grid cabin, I knew more than people who worked the business for 20 years.

    When it’s was time for a new roof, I needed to know more about roofs than any human needs to know.

    I’ve walked into stores and in addition to walking out with a product, I’ve had job offers because I know more than the sales staff.

    I’ve basically sold a car at a dealership because a potential customer wanted a brochure. It happened to be the car I was looking at.

    Some days I can spend up to 16 hours online reading, watching you tube, and visiting forums learning. In fact I’m doing it right now, lol.
    Prioritise. Losing weight alone won't make you any stronger, but on the plus side you will fit into your clothes.

    I disagree that lifestyle diet change is any more or less applicable that fitness training lifestyle changes. Everyone can argue their favourite option, but in the end it doesn't matter because if you have to do something if you are unhappy with the way things are. If you can neither stick to a lifetime of training, nor a lifetime of diet changes, then you might as well give up before you start. Pick the one you know you can stick to for the rest of your life, make progress and then see if that helps you phase in the other option.

    The best one for you is the one that brings results - and that one is the one you have put the effort into maintaining.

    If you can manage both changes together, good on you, but I think that is harder to manage. Not impossible, but will likely be more stressful and hence that stress may have a tendency to impact on both paths and ultimately you will sabotage your progress and convince yourself that it's not worth it.

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
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    192

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    My own experience.. I am 47 6'4" started out 315 lbs type 2 diagnosis.

    I did NLP and only consumed carbs around workouts... Lyle McDonald says you need 100G carbs to support weight training. Other days I just ate my meat and veggies, I still eat a lot. I now sit at about 260 with decent blood work. I am not as strong as I would have been in a surplus, but stronger than when I began and a shitload healthier. You can do both, it's just not optimal, but optimal < health. YMMV

  6. #46
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Chattanooga, TN
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    17

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    You and I are a lot alike sir, we're both wired very similarly. The thing that broke me of that learning pattern was "done is better than perfect." I kept that statement as my mission for a full year. I'd consider adopting it as your motto for the coming 2018 year. Make it a constant practice. Put it in front if you. I wrote on my mirror, a sticky note in my truck, had it in my workspace at work, you have to beat it into the depths of your brain so it'll stick and not be shoved out by your old patterns.

    I'm the same way you are in that I have been watching and learning about SS since 2015. Only now have I gotten into training, and still being brand new, there are a LOT, I MEAN A LOT of reasons that could convince me not to even try this thing. Here's the thing about "knowing" stuff.

    Knowing is nothing without doing. The apostle Paul said faith without works is dead. He's not wrong. That was really hard for me to figure out, but I got it, I mean really deeply got it. I know a lot about a lot of things, and I think I took a lot of comfort in that because it was how I made up, subliminally, for the other parts of myself that I found lacking. One day I had to understand that it was all BS. Experience is what I really wanted. I have known for years that I needed to clean up my diet and take care of my body. Who doesn't know that?

    I identify with your car purchase, I've had similar experiences. I always try to learn everything about something before I make a purchase. Most of my life that has equated to paralysis of analysis, leading to, ultimately, inaction. Perfectionism keeps you from making decisions that way. If I can't get the thing the exact way I perceive to be best, I just wont get it. If I can't do the thing perfectly, I won't do it. I have suffered with this for years, and it didn't change until I was able to give myself permission to just be a bull in a china shop a few times concerning things that were not high stakes. I called it 'mistaking my way through" rather than overanalyzing everything all the time. I found something out. If I was willing to mistake my way through something, I still learned everything I needed to know, and I knew it experientially, rather than theoretically. Another great "motto" of mine became "act now, make corrections as you go." This is exactly how the thermostat in your home works. It doesn't kick on and change the temperature until there's a deviation. Be okay with deviating, and when you realize a correction needs to be made, you kick into action and fix it then. If you take a look at my training log you'll see my power rack is made from 2x6's. That's what I had on hand, and it was sort of my middle finger to myself for making the excuse that I couldn't afford all these weights, racks, etc. Money was really tight, but I was not okay with just sitting around feeling like shit anymore. So I acted. And now, if anyone has a problem with my setup, that's good for them. I'll still be squatting, pressing, and deadlifting while they sit around judging me.

    Don't be afraid to reach out for help as well my friend. Like Jenni said, everyone has a different path to break the barriers and mental blocks that keep you from acting. It's a journey. My reason now for doing this is because after listening to the Barbell Logic Podcast I can clearly see that training under heavy weights helps you way more than just physically. It fixes and refines mental, emotional, and maybe even spiritual perception too. This is what I'm after. I have plenty of health excuses I could use to keep me from training. Not gonna happen. As Austin says, what are you going to do? Not train? (Another motto I have adopted now.)

    Also, and this is probably the most important thing I could point you to, read this:

    To Be A Beast | Barbell Medicine

    You will find that Jordan very clearly outlines that in cases where high body fat percentages are noted in a novice lifter, he will recommend some conditioning training to add in the benefit of eliminating visceral body fat, while still doing the SS linear progression. That article is more than worth your time and attention. You will understand the foundation for successful weight loss, muscle protein synthesis, and strength development. And since Jordan is a medical doctor who is ACTIVELY participating in the development of this information, well, let's just say he's qualified.

    Stay with it my friend. You're not in this thing alone.

  7. #47
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    Sep 2017
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    Thanks for that Jeremy. I’d like to add a comment a co worker would always make to me... “show me don’t tell me”. I always knew everything, researched everything, and talked about everything. It’s kinda along the same lines of done is better than perfect.

    To be a beast was a good read. It’s actually nice to have a medical doctor who advocates for weight training. My own doctor told me at last years physical to “just do cardio”.

    For now I’ve been practicing the lifts with an empty bar (very difficult for me as I want to add weight), and getting used to lifting shoes as I’ve always lifted barefoot. I’m acting like someone who has never lifted before. I’m not relearning, I’m learning for the first time.

    Eventually I’d like to,try the eating recommendations according to be a beast, but if I’m being honest I prob won’t count calories. I just won’t.

    I think I’m just gonna stop drinking coke, and milk. This alone will most likely see weight loss. I’ll just drink water.

    Clean, “real” foods. Half my plate will be veggies, the other half will be a 50/50 split of protein and carbs. I’ll eat about 3 or 4 times a day.

    I’ll start with SS only and see where we go. If I add conditioning it will likely be daily LISS as I don’t have the proposer HITT equipment. I have an elliptical and kettlebells. I was saddened to hear kettlebell swings weren’t optimum as I absolutely love doing two handed swings.

    I suppose I could by a rower.

    I also picked up a cheapo Amazon Pakistan made belt. It will do for now but I’m considering a couple of belts from pioneer.

  8. #48
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    Jun 2016
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    Tasmania, Australia
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    You can do HIIT on an elliptical. And as far as just cutting out coke and milk, that’s fine. Even just swap to zero sugar coke. You don’t have to change everything at once. Just make small changes that you can sustain, and as you start to see results you may well find yourself motivated to make more.

    Good luck.

  9. #49
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
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    192

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    Coke zero calorie in the black cans is not bad.. .Dr Pepper zero there is barely a difference. The Arizona Ice Tea, Arnold Palmer zero is quite tasty.

    I had to cut all that shit out years ago with the diabeetus.

    If you stop taking in calories from beverages you will likely spontaneously lose weight.

    Anyhow yea.. I am kind of the same... paralysis by analysis.....lesson i learned is that "perfect often gets in the way of good enough."

  10. #50
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    Sep 2017
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    starting strength coach development program
    If I go off coke, it’s straight to plain water. No diet drinks. I often wonder if the crap that’s in them is worse than the corn syrup in regular drinks. Not drinking calories is huge. I’m weird as I like milk with ketchup chips. Those calories add up.

    As for the elliptical, Dr. Jordan has them at the bottom of his list of HITT, and he recommends daily LISS if you don’t have the proper equipment.

    If need be I will buy a concept rower, or aero type bike but for now I’m gonna clean up the eating and start lifting. More than likely from the responses I’ve been getting I won’t need conditioning.

    What I need is reconditioning from being brainwashed for years into thinking all I need is cardio and body weight p90x type excersise.

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