Barbell logic's approach to intermediate programming

[Charlie Davies]

You can incorporate RPE into a very simple intermediate program like HLM, you don't need to go full-on RTS/BBM complexity with it right away.

Just run HLM and record your half-assed RPEs for the last set of sets across on heavy day. If that last set was @8.5 or less, add weight next week. If it was @9 or more, don't.
Take video of this set, and look at how much the bar-speed drops on the last reps. One slow rep is about RPE 8. Two slow reps, with that last one grindy, is about RPE 9.

Every once in a while, run the last set out to near failure, AMRAP style, to make sure you aren't sandbagging. Not often, maybe monthly.

This is really similar to how a coach-supervised HLM would work, with the coach judging the weight increases you can handle. Calling it RPE just makes it easier to talk about.

[jonfla]

While I'm not completely sold on the added complexity of something like The Bridge, particularly straight from LP, I think you're overestimating the difficulty of learning RPE. It's definitely not an 8-week process, especially if you start to practice rating (rating, not prescribing) RPE during your novice LP sets. Write down your guess after the set, then watch the video later and compare how you felt to how it looked. You'll get the hang of it rather quickly. Plus, you don't really have to be perfect with RPE for the concept to be useful in training.



Yes, if you fully exhaust your LP you will definitely know what @9/9.5/10 feels like...

I'll second this. I'm in week 7 of the bridge. If you've done the SSLP: the bench variations (long pause, close grip) are not hard to learn, the deadlift variations (rack pulls, paused) are not hard to learn, the squat variations (paused, pin, beltless) are not hard to learn. If you successfully ran LP, RPE ratings of 7-9 are not terribly difficult to assign. They won't be perfect at first, but they don't need to be perfect for you to continue to make progress.

As far as I can tell, people tend to drastically overstate how difficult it will be to transition from LP to the bridge.

I'm not even trying to weigh into the argument about optimizing intermediate training. But let's not get carried away and overestimate how difficult it is to pick this stuff up. If you're really struggling on the bridge, I would guess that 1) you probably didn't run a successful LP, and 2) you need a coach, at least in the short term.

[chrisza]

My argument is not that RPE can't be learned or isn't useful. I just don't believe it would nessesary to asign it as an early intermediate when weekly scheduled PR's are on the table for you.

If you set up an early intermediate template correctly based off your ending LP, your like likely hitting RPE 7-8 for you main worksets and RPE 8-9 for your intensity sets. At least for the 1st month or so. Your gonna learn RPE along your training life anyway by experience. The Ed Coan reference was a good one.

[chrisza]

I'll second this. I'm in week 7 of the bridge. If you've done the SSLP: the bench variations (long pause, close grip) are not hard to learn, the deadlift variations (rack pulls, paused) are not hard to learn, the squat variations (paused, pin, beltless) are not hard to learn. If you successfully ran LP, RPE ratings of 7-9 are not terribly difficult to assign. They won't be perfect at first, but they don't need to be perfect for you to continue to make progress.

As far as I can tell, people tend to drastically overstate how difficult it will be to transition from LP to the bridge.

I'm not even trying to weigh into the argument about optimizing intermediate training. But let's not get carried away and overestimate how difficult it is to pick this stuff up. If you're really struggling on the bridge, I would guess that 1) you probably didn't run a successful LP, and 2) you need a coach, at least in the short term.

You have to keep in mind. Most people on these boards are obsessed/anal with their training. For the average Joe, I don't think they're gonna get it like you.

[jonfla]

You have to keep in mind. Most people on these boards are obsessed/anal with their training. For the average Joe, I don't think they're gonna get it like you.

Maybe so.

[whale]

You have to keep in mind. Most people on these boards are obsessed/anal with their training. For the average Joe, I don't think they're gonna get it like you.

Yep. Bunch of people did SS because it's simple. The simple approach will always be more appealing to them.

[Fulcrum]

seems prescriptive: "leave one in the tank" aka @rpe9

Michael Montfort on Instagram: “Very detailed instructions from @coachnikolai. #startingstrength #ussf #wfac #wichitafallsathleticclub #doyourfives”

[Niki Sims]

seems prescriptive: "leave one in the tank" aka @rpe9

Michael Montfort on Instagram: “Very detailed instructions from @coachnikolai. #startingstrength #ussf #wfac #wichitafallsathleticclub #doyourfives”

Nick and Michael have a long-standing coach and client relationship. They've developed his understanding of RPE. There is a lot more programming and conversation in addition to this snap shot that provide context.

[andregraca]

seems prescriptive: "leave one in the tank" aka @rpe9

Michael Montfort on Instagram: “Very detailed instructions from @coachnikolai. #startingstrength #ussf #wfac #wichitafallsathleticclub #doyourfives”

I love this screenshot and will fight for it.

[KangaJoo]

Should we start talking about when to start having trainees work on their conditioning next?