Strong Traps

[78704]

Hise shrugs after squats and shrugs after deadlifts made my traps bigger and stronger. Doing really long complexes; 2-3 hang power snatches then 2-3 hang power cleans then 2-3 hang high pulls then shrugs made me really sore, but it didn't make any of my lifts go up.

[StrongIslander,NY]

high pulls and upright rows are they the same thing?

[Mark Rippetoe]

At the bottom of page 6 there is a series of photos.

So where would be the best place to put those in TM.

Ah, word order comprehension interference. The way I use them is in a 2x/week program, with rack pulls/halting on Tuesday, barbell shrugs/cleans on Friday.

high pulls and upright rows are they the same thing?

No, not even close.

[simonsky]

why does the barbell have to be in the pins rather than from the floor for shrugging? is it to prevent the excessive back strain?

and what does bill mean when he says pulling the shrug higher with the target above head? i don't get it, how will you hit that target? with your head by jumping?

[Mark Rippetoe]

Because when the bar is loaded on the floor, it's too close to the floor to be a shrug. And yes, you'll hit the target with your head so you have to be very careful so that you don't make a bump.

[simonsky]

Because when the bar is loaded on the floor, it's too close to the floor to be a shrug. And yes, you'll hit the target with your head so you have to be very careful so that you don't make a bump.

so to be clear the shrug referred here involves some ankle/knee/hip extension not just purely shoulders?

[Mark Rippetoe]

Is this actually not clear to you? Or do you just want somebody to answer a post?

[thersites]

high pulls and upright rows are they the same thing?

High pulls are pulled from the floor with the same mechanics/form as the clean or the snatch (depending on which high pull you are performing) with more weight than you can rack in the full movement. They rely on the pull from the hips, the full extension of the body including up onto the toes, and some shrug to get the bar to the target height (most of the power coming from the hip pull and full extension of the body).

The upright row starts from a hang type position & pulls mainly with the arms and deltoids with a bit of trap & upper back, and is not done with the explosiveness of the high pulls, nor with as many muscles. It does not come close to the high pulls for helping improve the clean or snatch. In other words, it is an inferior movement for those who will not take the time to learn the clean, snatch, and their respective high pulls. The upright row is worse than inferior in that it also may lead to bad clean & snatch technique by causing the lifter to use the arms in the pull.

I would add that high pulls are a lot of fun as an assistance lift for your cleans & snatches.

[simonsky]

Is this actually not clear to you? Or do you just want somebody to answer a post?

no it is really not clear to me, sorry. maybe because i am asian and not even the racially stereotyped smart asian.

[Mark Rippetoe]

I thought you were Polish. Just read the description of the exercise. I think it's actually in the article.