Sounds quite low-carb to me. Not a good strategy if you're trying to gain lots of muscle.Originally Posted by DOM
TMPHBITEU
Gance has not done the program. The math does not lie.
Member
Sounds quite low-carb to me. Not a good strategy if you're trying to gain lots of muscle.
Member
Right... Well actually wrong.
Your squat should be around 225 by now had you been adding weight to the bar every workout as prescribed.
Member
Doesn't 10 pounds in 2 months say it all? Sounds like drastically under eating or under training!
Member
I've largely stayed away from posting on this board because, well, almost every question I've ever had is already answered here or in the books. With that said, I see a lot of posts concerning fat gain on the program and hopefully my personal experience can help someone make the right decisions (despite the fact that Mark already gives you the right decisions in his books, if you're stubborn, like I was, maybe some anonymous internet poster will convince you, cause, you know, what does Mark know about these things...). Anyway....
I started SS in May of last year. At the time, I was 33, 5'11, 230 pounds and fat. I read the book but thought I was special and decided that I could lose weight and make progress on the program. So I tracked my food intake and ate about 2200 calories a day. I lost a steady 1-2 pounds a week. For about 3 months, the weights on all my lifts went up. Everything was great and I had proven Mark wrong.....
Well, until the stalls started. About 3 months in, I was down to about 215 and my lifts started stalling. Not just a little, all the time. I was resetting constantly and getting very frustrated. I even went over to the Texas method, thinking I had "graduated" to the intermediate level. 3-4 months of this and I was down to 200 pounds, and my lifts were stuck. I would hit 225 on the squat, try to progress, but never could. I would reset, work back up to 225, then stall again. Thankfully I was stubborn enough to not quit, but I was not making progress and it was frustrating.
So... In October I got over the weight loss obsession, started drinking the milk and eating like a human again. I went from 195 to 210 in 2 months. It wasn't a huge weight gain, but my lifts were going up again. I went back to SS and exhausted the gains I had left, then went on the Texas method. Now I weigh about 220, with 270 5RM squat, 220 5RM bench, 340 5RM deadlift, and 150 5RM press.
What's the point? The point is I wasted a lot of time. If I had followed the program from the beginning, I would probably be no fatter than I am now and also be a lot stronger. But, I don't care, I learned the hard way. And for me, it was confirmation that this stuff works. If you stick with it and follow it, it will work. If you are a cynical, skeptical bastard like me, don't follow it and when things start to fall apart, come here, find the answer, apply it, see that it works, and eventually convince yourself that you should have listened to begin with.
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Pen: I'm certain I've put on plenty of muscle as there wasn't too much to start with and my lifts are much stronger than before when I started at only 95 after surgery (I started low to be safe, regular max was about 115), and I just finished a 160 squat. Most I've ever done.
However, I've clearly gained a decent amount of fat too... I was eating about 2400 daily, sticking to cottage cheese and 2% milk as well as protein drinks to keep the protein intake high. I'm going to drop to 2200 now and see if there is anything else I can drop food wise that might be bad. My concern was that I didn't want to keep this extra fat and want to fit in my clothes.
Mr. Rippetoe: I'm sorry, I just don't understand what you mean. I am trying to stick to the program the best I can, I have been doing my best for form, I have the book and just got the DVD (that fixed my power clean form so much...). Please, could you at least hint at what I should look at or what you mean by your statement that I'm not doing the program?
I really want to improve, and I want to fix my mistakes.
Member
Given this, I'm curious what the next action should be (other than doing the program): should he "strip" the fat down, or begin SS in earnest and expect bf levels of 25-30% at the end, and then deal with that?
It's interesting because I've often wondered if the body is more efficient gaining muscle and strength at a lower level of fat than a higher one, or if it makes any difference whatsoever.
Member
For two months that progression on squat is pretty minimal. I've only been doing the program for just 47 days and my squat has gone from 95 lbs to 200 lbs. I've gained a good amount of weight but little fat from what i can tell. What have you been doing to only go up 42.5 lbs in squat in two months? You're doing something wrong.
✓ Member
He needs to learn how to squat and add 5 pounds to the bar every workout. His stated progression comes out to about 5 pounds a week. At the weights he is using, he could have probably added 10 lbs a workout for a little while. For a male, squatting 150 lbs is not very much weight and does not stress the body enough to drive the kind of adaptation that is required. If he's only adding 2 lbs or less to his deads and the rest of his lifts, therein lies the problem.
As Rippetoe said, he's not doing SS. He may need to cough up some money and get a coach to help for a bit, if form is a big problem. If he is getting fat eating 2400 calories a day, there may be something else wrong, too.
Member
Ok. I guess I'll spoon feed. One more time.
If you are "doing the program", then you are squatting three times a week, alternating between bench pressing and pressing, and alternating between deadlifting and power cleaning (eventually working towards deadlifting once a week after the first couple of weeks). That means there are five total exercises with only three of them performed on a given day.
The lifts that don't start off the floor will have a rep scheme of 3 sets of 5 reps, sets across (same weight). You will only have one work set of deadlifts at five reps. Power cleans will be five sets of three reps.
Down the road in your linearly progressing journey, assistance exercises may be in order, but not right now. For information on those, look at the book(s) (hopefully again).
Given your progress (or lack thereof), you have not done this. Go do this.
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