Another old guy starting and some questions

[DrPhilWV]

Quick bio and some metrics
43 male couch potato physician in WV
5'6" starting wt 200 with 30+% body fat
Last time I lifted weight - I suspect early 1990's?
Why? Tired of being weak and out of shape. I coach youth wrestling and can't roll much.
So hell with it. I was sent here by Brian Jones who made unreal recovery after bilateral broken legs. I've been playing around a bit working on form for squat, press, bench, and dead lift only. On the in between days I am doing some sort of short (30/45min) core/abs work. 1 off day per week. Other than HRT my supplements have been minimal so far. Some protein shakes post workout. Considering adding creatine.
My numbers
Squat 135 3x5
Press 85 3x5
Bench 115 3x5
Dead lift 195 1x5
I don't have the luxury of a regular spotter so I haven't tried to push it too much yet, but on the last rep I'm struggling to keep form. I have a terrible right shoulder that is painful on the bench. It feels fantastic after a "press" day which means I probably need the work on those upper back muscles. Anyway, no where to go but up. Wish me luck!
Doc Phil



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[DrPhilWV]

Questions - any supplements that are "must try" for the middle age set!
Any way to work around the damn bench? It's the only exercise where I get a true joint pain afterward
What's the protein supplement of choice on here? I use the Jay Robb brand now
Creatine? Yes or no for my age set?


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[veryhrm]

0) hi
1) is of course, read the book (Starting Strength) (and Practical Programming helps too. 3rd editon of PP is in pre-order now).
1.5) how long have you been at it ?
2) read around in the Nutrition subforum and various others. Search the site using google. (i.e. site:startingstrength.com protein powder) asking general questions w/o research is (theoretically) frowned upon. (mmm... enabling...)
3) you don't need any sups. (esp. w/ TRT). I guess people are pretty big on fish oil. Ok and maybe i'd say take some magnesium. But you don't really need any of it. Read the supplement sticky in Nutrition.
4) The protein you got is fine, (but expensive). I like MuscleFeast brand or ON Natural but it's mostly all fine.
5) What's wrong w/ your shoulder? You don't generally need a spotter (at least until it gets really heavy and you can't unrack it yourself) if you have a power rack you can bench in. (and set the safeties such that they would protect your shoulder [edit: i mean neck!]). But yeah, if the shoulder is iffy it's prob better to be conservative. Sometimes there are form problems that can make your shoulder worse. if you search as above there is discussion of various shoulder issues.

6) I'm guessing you don't have many pull-ups currently? Perhaps add in some lat pull-downs and start working in the direction of chins or pull-ups.
7) you don't need (or want) 30/45 minutes of core/abs work and if anyone here finds out you will be taunted. Squats, DLs and presses ARE abs work.
7.5) i actually kind of like planks and i think maybe they were useful, but not sure.

good luck.

read this:
http://www.fitocracy.com/knowledge/o...for-fitocrats/
and this:
http://barbellmedicine.com/2012/07/29/584/
and maybe this:
http://startingstrength.com/index.ph..._clarification
You're really not old and just outside the window. w/ the TRT (upon which i (some random guy on the internet) somewhat frown esp for young people such as yourself, but most people here think it's good stuff and i reserve the right to change my mind down the road) you might even be hormonally in the window. don't know.

[DrPhilWV]

TRT - was 2 SD below bottom of normal range. Thought was possibly due to too much weight cutting back in HS for wrestling. Was clinical, not subclinical. Levels still near bottom of the range but I feel I can tell a difference. I read the book. Also read on the protein supplements. What I get from it is whey. I was more concerned on the palatability issue.


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[DrPhilWV]

Sorry - struggling with this darn ap.
Shoulder - labrum tear and rotator cuff tear. Repaired but have substantial arthritis from waiting too long for the repair.
I've been working on form and appropriate weights for 10 days give or take. Eating cleaner 2 weeks.
Looks like people track their protein grams. Will try to start that.
No pull ups or dips yet, but looking forward to them
The abs/core stuff is because mine is horribly weak. In reading SS I know how Mark feels the lifts build a solid core. I'm not close to there yet. Doing some yoga to for flexibility. Flame away at that bit of info.

My goal is simply to do some damn thing. I like the bio mechanical approach in SS. It's something I can understand. As there isn't really a "new member" area, this was simply a first attempt (other than the articles etc) to get some opinions.

I greatly appreciate the help. I hate typing on this damn iPad. Just got off night shift from the hospital. Going to sleep a few hours then off to the gym.

Phil


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[DV]

I also refuse to type anything lengthy on my iPad. A few pointers on the things you suggested. I'd really recommend you dive into the reading that has been suggested, read the book a few times (there's a lot in there to digest), especially the bits you're having difficulties with (for me it was the squat), and trawl the forums.

Creatine is a must have supp. It helps most people, costs next to nothing, and is just a teaspoon of powder a day. 1-2g of EPA/DHA might also help joint issues. Glucosamine/chondroitin (sp?) is more hit and miss from what I understand. As for whey just get whatever is cheapest/tastes the best to you.

Lots of guys have had great success using Close Grip Bench Press as their main pressing exercise. You could switch the normal bench for this or - as a lot of us do - use a "narrow" normal bench grip.

On the in between days, you'd be better off doing some HARD conditioning intervals, something like 20s all out effort on a rowing machine/stationary bike and then 1.30-1.40 of no/low effort. Do 7 intervals or so, start with once per week moving up to twice. There's a bit more on this in the nutrition forum. I wouldn't waste time with core work, except perhaps some ab-work at the end of the workout, part of warmup or something.

Welcome on board. Start up a log to keep yourself accountable, and have somewhere to refer people to if/when you run into problems. If you stick with this, you'll be amazed where you are in 6 months.

[Walter Palmer]

DrPhilWV, welcome aboard.

In regards to the bench press, it is possible that you may just have to consider dropping this from the program. It is the one lift that can continue to hurt your shoulder. First, I would try close grip bench or dumbbell bench press as these are sometimes easier on the shoulder for many people. Also, I would be extremely cautious about dips. It is a great exercise but can be very hard on the shoulders and isn't something you can probably do with proper form at current strength levels.

I second the idea of planks. For me, planks and hanging leg raises are the "core" workouts that are best.

In regards to protein, most people don't get enough. Jordan tells me that older people aren't as efficient with protein so they need more. I can't give you a specific recommendation, at least not a scientifically informed one, but would guess you probably need to be around 200 grams of protein a day given your size.

[Karl Schudt]

You might want to do a form check for bench press. Make sure you aren't too wide on your grip and that you are coming down to an inch or so above the bottom of the sternum.

If they still won't work for you, it's not the worst thing in the world to drop them from the program, although Dom Mazetti would weep.

[paterfamilias]

I (m, 46) get whey protein isolate from TrueNutrition for about $11/lb.

Definitely keep track of your macro intake, and make sure you are eating enough of everything, and regularly -- not just when you feel like you need it. This was the one of my biggest mental blocks, and when I finally got with the program, recovery was worlds better, and my stalled lifts unstalled.

And creatine good.

[G1981C]

Supplements:

* multivitamin - life extension foundation mix capsules ( 14 capsules per day )
* fish oil caps - a handful per day ( Carlsson Labs Elite or New Chapter Wholemega )
* Glucosamine / Chondroitin / MSM ( I use Doctor's Best brand )
* Potassium Gluconate Powder ( I use Now Foods brand )
* Collagen ( I use Doctor's Best brand )
* green superfood powders such as HealthForce Vitamineral Green
* Bee Pollen

you can throw in extra Vitamin C and D, although they are included in good doses in LEF MIX already.

Food:

* grass fed organic meat.
* organic organ meats ( livers, kidneys etc // impossible to find )
* low-mercury, low-fukushima, wild caught fish ( good luck LOL )
* fresh, slow-pressed juice from organic vegetables.
* whole fruits and vegetables, focus on cruciferous, avoid sweet.
* green smoothies using vitamix blender ( kale, spinach etc )
* hemp seeds, hemp seed oil, chia seed oil
* caviar
* dark organic chocolate ( 80% or more )

i think Creatine is shit. just my personal opinion. the worst thing anybody can take is legal over the counter muscle building supplements. the only muscle building supplements worth taking are all illegal. given enough time the government bans everything that is good, so if it isn't banned it is either crap, or completely new and thus untested and risky.

frankly, with proper regimen nobody needs to take any muscle building supplements to look good and be fit. you only need them to win competitions or impress meatheads at the gym. i only take supplements for health.