5/3/1 and Front Squat Sub/Injury question

[JCavin]

I've been doing the simplest strength template for a bit now. I've been having a lot of success, with a personal record for almost every workout.

Just recently I started having tendonitis in my elbow and some pain in my shoulder. I think i've narrowed down the cause to front squats.

Considering my numbers(only squatting 315 for 1 rep), would just doing regular back squats be a sufficient sub for them(the percentages would be lower, so it would be like doing a light squat day after I perform 5/3/1 on deadlifts)? I know the front squats are to help with quad development, but i'm not sure that i'm advanced enough to even worry about that yet.

[yellowmamba]

I've been doing the simplest strength template for a bit now. I've been having a lot of success, with a personal record for almost every workout.

Just recently I started having tendonitis in my elbow and some pain in my shoulder. I think i've narrowed down the cause to front squats.

Considering my numbers(only squatting 315 for 1 rep), would just doing regular back squats be a sufficient sub for them(the percentages would be lower, so it would be like doing a light squat day after I perform 5/3/1 on deadlifts)? I know the front squats are to help with quad development, but i'm not sure that i'm advanced enough to even worry about that yet.

Actually, the most likely cause is low-bar squatting with a too narrow grip, which can really beat up your shoulders and elbows.

Unless you are front squatting like a retard, i.e. holding the bar in your hand, they should not cause any problems whatsoever. Or maybe prolonged low-bar squatting has fucked up your mechanics so you excessively use "hip drive" out of the hole, forcing your upper body forward.

Learn to squat properly:



Or if you can't, stretch so you can. In the meantime continue to do low bar squats. Then transition to the real squat.

[JCavin]

Lol @ real squat.

Yes, a "light squat" after deadlifts will work fine and drive progress. Andy baker recommends something along the lines of 3 ramping sets of 5. Like 225/235/245 after deadlifts. Worked nicely for me, while it lasted.

Once you get the tendonitis under control, if you want to keep front squatting, I'd deload and work on your mechanics. The "vertical torso" can feel really weird after low bar squatting exclusively, but its not impossible to do both by any stretch of the imagination. You just have to think about it more.

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Thanks man. I'm thinking i'll just use the same percentages and reps that I use for front squats. They're all ramping sets. The first two weeks are just higher rep.

[Tom Narvaez]

i'm going to guess that you don't have access to a SSB. i generally think that is a pretty solid sub for front squats.


yes, all of us should do "real" squats like yellowmamba. it is very important that you do not have an "inflated squat". i don't want to see any of you guys squatting more than 400lbs or so. yellowmamba has never needed that much and he is an AMAZING athlete.

edit: you are a he, right? i'm not quite sure because of the weight/height/lifting stats and volleyball combo. if you ARE a chick, which i doubt because then you'd actually be pretty impressive, apologies in advance.

[JCavin]

Tom,
Nah I don't. I was just talking about this today with a friend. We need one.

I'm thinking I'll try front squats a couple more times just to be sure it is the cause of tr shoulder pain. If so I'll have to switch to back squats twice a week. Honestly I'd rather do back squats because fronts are brutal at high reps

[Tom Narvaez]

you could also do manta ray high bar squats. manta rays are these things:


traditionally used by pussys who think the bar hurts, it actually raises the bar on your back 2-3". makes a high bar squat a SUPER high bar squat, lol. the mechanics are pretty similar to a front squat without the front rack issues.

of course, a ssb is better, imo, because it actively pulls you forward.

[DRice311]

How do you rack the bar JCavin?

Does the zombie grip still bother the elbow and shoulder? Could be a temporary solution so you don't have to abandon the program until the inflammation goes down.

[JCavin]

I just use the clean rack. I'm not sure i'm brave enough to try the zombie "grip" lol. I'm going to really work on stretching and icing this weekend and see what happens.