Power Clean form check

[ronpaek100]

Hey guys I've read the power clean sections over a couple times but I just can't seem to get the lift right..

As far as my own analysis on my lift:
1. I feel like my initial pull off the floor is me leading with my chest, back angle seems to change before my knees even extend to help the bar get off the floor

2. I think I keep my arms pretty straight for the most part they don't bend until I jump, but I notice I don't get into full extension with my hips and knees

My question is:
1. Is my initial pull off the floor right? am I unlocking my knees first using quads to help the initial pull?
2. For the second pull am I jumping too early or do I need to wait longer to innate the jump?
3. How can I improve my second pull so I get full hip extension and knee extension?
4. Is my rack position okay, I still feel like i'm catching it in my hands, even though my elbows seem like they are pointing straight

Any help would really be appreciated

[ronpaek100]

The main thing I want to know at least is am I catching the bar right in the rack position or in my hands? I know a lot of other things about my form is wrong.. still trying to figure things out

[Jonathon Sullivan]

Hey guys I've read the power clean sections over a couple times but I just can't seem to get the lift right..

As far as my own analysis on my lift:

1. I feel like my initial pull off the floor is me leading with my chest, back angle seems to change before my knees even extend to help the bar get off the floor

Yup. Actually, this is a pretty good pick-up on your part. You're extending at the hip too early. Use your legs in the first pull, keep your hip angle constant, and save hip extension for the second pull.

2. I think I keep my arms pretty straight for the most part they don't bend until I jump, but I notice I don't get into full extension with my hips and knees

Maybe you need more weight on the bar. Seriously, see below for my thoughts on this.

My question is:
1. Is my initial pull off the floor right? am I unlocking my knees first using quads to help the initial pull?

We have already established that you aren't.

2. For the second pull am I jumping too early or do I need to wait longer to innate the jump?

To my eye, you are jumping from the middle of the thigh. This looks okay. We'll see if any of the other coaches differ.

3. How can I improve my second pull so I get full hip extension and knee extension?

You're sort of answering your own question here.

A couple of cues I've had luck with are "head through the ceiling" and "clean it with your ass."

When I do clean triples, I make each set about something. For example, for my first set I'll think about improving my elbow slam. In my second triple I'll think about full extension. In my third set I'll focus on stomping into my own footprints with a solid receiving position. And so on.

All of that being said, take a look:

formcheck031013.JPG


This looks like pretty decent triple extension to me. The real problem here isn't your extension. The real problem is that you're in California and the bar is in Vermont. It's too far out in front of you. That fucker should be a pube's breadth from your shirt. I'd worry more about that, honestly.

4. Is my rack position okay, I still feel like i'm catching it in my hands, even though my elbows seem like they are pointing straight

I didn't think the elbows were too bad, actually; I've seen (and done) much worse. I often think "stomp-slam" when I clean. This integrates the stomp and the elbow slammage at one instant, and makes both more powerful.

These cleans need work, but they really aren't so bad. You've learned enough about the form that you can critique your own performance intelligently. Fix your bar path, stop lifting with your back in the first pull, think "stomp-slam" and add some weight. Carry on.

[ronpaek100]

All of that being said, take a look:

formcheck031013.JPG


This looks like pretty decent triple extension to me. The real problem here isn't your extension. The real problem is that you're in California and the bar is in Vermont. It's too far out in front of you. That fucker should be a pube's breadth from your shirt. I'd worry more about that, honestly.

I been trying so hard to keep the bar close to my shirt on the way up, I can't figure out how to do it, I started to practice holding a bar and even putting weight on it and just practicing the hang position and lower to the jump position and jumping to get better at it, do you think I need to actively think about pushing it back with my lats as i jump up?

Maybe this will all clear up when I fix the initial first pull?

Thank you for the feedback Jonathon, this has helped immensely, i'll keep you posted on my form.

One more quick question, in that picture of me in triple extension, would that be considered bent elbows / arm pull? I know I have been constantly thinking about straight elbows since the very beginning but maybe I need to try harder.

[Jonathon Sullivan]

I been trying so hard to keep the bar close to my shirt on the way up, I can't figure out how to do it, I started to practice holding a bar and even putting weight on it and just practicing the hang position and lower to the jump position and jumping to get better at it, do you think I need to actively think about pushing it back with my lats as i jump up?

Maybe this will all clear up when I fix the initial first pull?

Perhaps. And you can try not to bounce it off your thigh. It's not horrible. Like I said, these cleans, while not perfect, are definitely getting there.

One more quick question, in that picture of me in triple extension, would that be considered bent elbows / arm pull? I know I have been constantly thinking about straight elbows since the very beginning but maybe I need to try harder.

No, I don't think so. This image is just after the jump, and the bar has been "launched." I didn't detect a lot of elbow in the second pull.

[ronpaek100]

Jonathon other people have commented and told me that my initial hip / starting position is too high, I have been reading over the SS and trying to figure things out, could you give me your opinion on if my hips are in the right position or if they are too high? Or if anyone else could give me there feedback.

http://i49.tinypic.com/2csewis.jpg

comparing my starting position with the models in the book I feel like i'm more like #3 which is obviously too high, but i'm not sure cause I really don't know how to apply and account for different antropometry.

[PFerrari]

Most people who do olympic lifts will tell you that the SS model of pulling puts the hips too high. It's been debated heavily and continues to be debated and probably will forever. Read both sides, play with both styles of pulling and see which one works best for you.

[ronpaek100]

My friend made a slo-motion gif for me to help check out my form.

[ronpaek100]

At the same time the bar racks, the feet stomp the floor. Since the feet must break contact with the floor if a jump occurs, they must set back down on the floor, and thinking about stomping is a way to make this happen explosively – like everything about the top of the clean needs to be. This foot movement causes everything happening simultaneously with it to synchronize better. It feels better when the feet stomp and the bar racks at exactly the same time, and your body will time the rack to coincide with the stomp. And if the stomp is fast, it pulls the rack along faster with it. The simultaneity of the two events is fairly automatic, and not too many people will stomp out of phase with the rack because it just feels too weird. So the stomp actually sharpens the timing of the racking movement. A certain amount of knee bend, necessary to cushion the catching of the weight, will accompany the stomp. Catching the weight with perfectly straight knees is not desirable and actually doesn’t occur very often since it also feels too weird. The stomp thus makes the movement faster, while cushioning the catch.

Rippetoe, Mark (2012-01-13). Starting Strength (Kindle Locations 5363-5371). The Aasgaard Company. Kindle Edition.

I just noticed and realized something after viewing the slow motion gif of my lift and re-reading the power clean section. Mark says that the stomp and the rack should happen almost simultaneously does this mean that i'm out of sync and that maybe i'm jumping hard enough or fully extending all the way on the second pull?

[Jonathon Sullivan]

Your rack and stomp could be better synced, yes. A cue I sometimes use is "stomp-slam!" Really, after you've felt a clean come together at that one instant, with everything locking into place at the moment you rack...well, it's a thing of beauty, and you remember it, and you start to chase it. I think the key for you is faster elbows on the rack.

I will say this: the gif really shows off your bar path error. Bar is a bit out in front. Now look at your feet when you rack. See how you come on to your toes just a bit? Funny how that works, eh? The gif also shows that you don't have any heinous arm pull.

In fact, I really like this gif thing. It makes analysis a lot easier. Okay, everybody, listen up: you all have to do gifs like the OP from now on.

Really, though, you are on track. You seem like the kind of guy who isn't going to settle for "just okay." Nothing like the silly fuck doing half-assed squats behind you. Keep doing what you're doing.