I don't know that the increase in lower body mass that always accompanies good results on this program would be helpful to a swimmer. Any swimmers with input on this?
Member
Doing SS during swimming season
Monday I'm starting swimming season.
This year I want to focus on sprinting events -- especially in the 50m (takes approximately 30 seconds) and occasionally in the 100m (takes approximately 1 minute) -- so getting stronger is vital. Because of that, I'd like to do Starting Strength.
I believe swimming wouldn't be detrimental if I was doing exclusively sprint work (short and intense bursts with lots of rest), but even if I'm focusing on shorter events, maintaining a decent level of conditioning is essential. So I think my coach will still have me do plenty of tough intervals.
I know that I will not progress nearly as fast as someone who is dedicating all of their time to SS, but I was wondering if I would still be able to recover and get decent gains from the strength workouts while doing these intense swimming workouts. If not, what modifications should I do to my training to able to do so?
Thank you.
André
TMPHBITEU
I don't know that the increase in lower body mass that always accompanies good results on this program would be helpful to a swimmer. Any swimmers with input on this?
Starting Strength Coach
Not a swimmer myself but I train many swimmers at my gym at the high school and collegiate level. All sprinters.Originally Posted by Mark Rippetoe
We have seen nothing but positive results from running the SS program with both our male and female athletes. Most of the college guys that came through this summer gained around 15-30 lbs. We also found that after the first few weeks on the program a twice per week routine works better from a recovery standpoint. Staying lean is a necessity for these guys so we really keep the diet in check so that there isn't any useless weight gained.
I feel like the power that these guys gain in their kicking negates the obvious drag in the water from the weight gain.....within reason.
Each of these athletes are individual and I listen for their feedback on how the lifting is effecting their performance in the pool. One of my larger guys (who is also 33) got up to about 220 lbs. He got tendonitis in his biceps and shoulders that he felt was due to pulling his increased mass through the water. Through diet we got him down to 205 (up from a starting weight of about 190) and now he is pain free and is FLYING in the water.
Most of the high school kids I get are doing very little in the way of strength training with their coaches at school. "Dryland" training mostly consists of things like push ups and hundreds and hundreds of reps of "core" work. The collegiate athletes are generally part of a lifting program but they usually suck.
We usually do 2 days per week of heavy lifting and one day per week of "dryland" conditioning. We have had good results doing multiple short sprints on the C2 Rower and short sprints with the Prowler. Our guys and gals have reported progress in the pool when their performance improves on both of these conditioning tools.
It has been fun working with this group of athletes and we have had good results across the board. As a result this program has grown into the largest sports program at my gym.
Member
I swam until last year, started when I was 7. I definitely slowed down after I started lifting, but only because I hadn't trained any swimming. Lifting will help you with swimming, to an extent. Even my brother who doesn't know shit about training lifts in the off season. Albeit, causally, and with no program.
Member
It is extremely helpful. A huge part of swimming is the turns and transitions off the wall. Watch Phelps in the Olympics and see how far he goes after each turn, all that distance and speed is gained by a monster push off the wall (mechanically very similar to a squat) and a very very powerful kick. Having participated in aquatic athletics at very high levels both as a athlete and a coach I have seen a direct positive benefit from developing a strong squat and swim times.
I will say though that I think Bench is a poor exercise for swimmers due to their already overdeveloped chest and anterior shoulders. This leads to A LOT of labral and rotator cuff tears, and is why I recommend a much larger focus on pull-ups, ring rows, power cleans, etc with Overhead Press as the primary pressing exercise. Basically back and rear deltoid work to balance the shoulder our and prevent injury.
I think during a season a very basic dry land routine of a couple days a week, comprised of squats and pull-ups/chin-ups is very manageable and will yield good benefits as long as you manage your recovery well. Once you hit off season, then go full bore with SS, and don't be afraid of weight gain as I have seen an athlete gain 40lbs and get faster.
Member
Well, most elite swimmers are using weight training regularly -- Michael Phelps has stated that squatting (I believed he box squats) was vital for his powerful underwater kick. I've also talked to several swimmers who have said that they have benefited a lot from similar plans to SS.
Besides, I forgot to mention that I am a breaststroker, which is the most leg dominant of the 4 strokes.
Thank you for you reply.
André
Member
I'm no competitive swimmer, however I do sprint swim at times for conditioning. Doing SS and sprint swimming is very taxing on the legs, like really difficult if you don't get enough nutrition between the two.
However the added muscle did help in terms of sprint times, so I'd suggest going for it. Honestly though, swim conditioning + SS = 1million calories a day. If there was ever a reason to drink a gallon of milk a day it would be this combination.
Member
Hello. Former swimmer here (age group, HS, div-3, some masters stuff on and off). Note that i didn't do SS or other serious lifting during my serious swimming days but have combined lifting w/ moderate swim training. So these thoughts are based on some amount of extrapolation.
The posterior chain strength (or rather power) is directly useful in starts and turns (for the push off) as these movements are basically jumps. These are comparatively short phases of the event, but they're important. The core strength (am i allowed to say that?) is also important to pretty much the whole stroke. Quads (and to a lesser extent hams and glutes) are important for kicking. Extra mass, while not helpful, would not be a significant penalty; not like it would be to a distance runner or something. The upper body work i think would be great. If my traps were then what they are now i probably would have been a much better fly swimmer.
As to how you'd program the lifting w/ 5-6 days of swimming... that i don't know. If your team has sprinter specific workouts and you're doing those then it shouldn't be a problem since those workouts are generally less taxing, but if you're doing general purpose swim training... it might be tough. Even in my mid-20s when i tried to swim 3 times a week w/ a masters' team and lift 3 times a week (non-SS 8 exercises 3x8 kind of stuff) it didn't work well. I could do it for maybe 2 weeks but by the 3rd i'd just get run down and have to skip sessions of one type or the other. And now, mid 30s, SS itself (+attempting to do chins) was more than enough to kick my ass w/ no other work. I get in the pool every now and again and for a few laps my upper body feels pretty strong, but my swimming isn't trained up at all right now so hard to say really what impact SS has had. Since you're young though it might work fine for you. HS summers i'd swim 2hr morning practice then go directly to my lifeguard job where we'd do another 30-45 minutes of calisthenics/running and then sometimes i'd play volleyball in the evenings and it seemed to work fine then...
Two more things: 1) The LB squats during SS took their toll on my elbows, and i also hurt some biceps related muscles while putting the weight down on two occasions. I couldn't bench press for a week or two here and there, BUT i also couldn't really swim more than a warm-up during those times either. Fine for me... but it would have been a huge issue during the swim season.
2) 50 Free specialists are the curl bros of swimming. Is that really what you want?
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I'm not a swimmer but I noticed this summer at the beach that I was swimming stronger and with much less fatigue, I mean I was feeling strong in the water. I think presses and chins had alot to do with it. I'm not kidding, I was racing my friends distances of 100m and had never felt like that.
✓ Member
I'm no expert (I haven't coached or analyzed this from a learned POV), but I did swim competitively from ages 7-17, so I'll throw in my 2 cents here.
Larger legs wouldn't hurt, but I can't see how a big ass in swimming would help. If you look at these guys it seems they are all shoulders and upper back. They taper radically. The legs help, but really are assistance and supplementary drivers.
It's a very technique driven sport.
Like oly lifting ;-)
That said, my coach 30 years ago started getting people into the weight room and I think a stronger back and core (yes coach, I said it) from squatting and deadlifting would help. All the strokes are based on pulling, so having power and strength from cleans, rows and deads have got to help. I would emphasize both horizontal and vertical pulls over pushes.
The arm stuff is at the muscle endurance level but having strong shoulders and upper back (facilitated by presses and chins) could only help. Many swimmers do end up with shoulder problems so those should help off-set potential injuries. You need big mobility in the shoulders, so I wouldn't do anything that would hamper that. I would consider not bench pressing, god-forbid. Rotate vert. and horz. pulls (instead of bench and press) and only shoulder press.
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